I never said "boo guns". In fact I pretty much stated what you just did. The problem is not the gun, but the person who owned the gun.

hmm...

wtf?

Yea, cops are very often the worst offenders, particularly patrol guys because they are ******ed and think the child can't figure out how to manipulate a locking holster, so they leave the gun in the holster and the duty belt accessible.

Thankfully my dept never had a death but they did have a child get a gun and fire it through the floor into the apartment beneath the officer.

Luckily no one was injured.

He was fired of course.

In that Marysville situation, the solution is simple. WEAR THE MOTHER****ING GUN YOU ******ED MOTHER****ING POS!!!

Oh, that particular cop is definitely an idiot, but he's a special breed of idiot imo. How the **** can you have a job where you carry a gun and still manage to be an irresponsible dickhead with that gun? Do cops seriously think kids can't figure out a locking holster? Figuring out puzzles is one of the basic skills all kids learn and this girl is 7. What the hell is wrong with that cop thinking a 7yo can't unholster a gun? Actually, what the hell is wrong with a cop that hasn't shipped his 7yo off to multiple gun safety courses?

Gun safety just isn't drilled in hard enough. Alot of the problem is gun training in general. Some cops never unholster their weapon except to qualify or if they need it.

I made it a point to fire 50 rds doing various drills at least 3-4x a week with my pistol.

Also LOL at my kids finding a gun in my truck. If there's a gun in my truck it's holstered and strapped to me and they'd have to take it away from me.

I'm in disagreement with you about the "several gun safety" courses though. Some disagree, but I still think 10 is about the optimal age to expose children to guns.

Prior to that it's very simple. Gun safety for a 7 y/o is "Don't touch guns. Ever" then doing everything necessary to ensure her curiousity is frustrated.

I don't think it's a gun safety issue. I mean obv it is but it's not.

Bottom line is many people are selfish and can't even be bothered w/ keeping their kids safe. It's not an ignorance issue, it's a lack of effort.

I'd like to see stiffer penalties for this. Maybe a mandatory 10 do 5 for this type of child neglect.

unfortunately there is no way to determine this ahead of time.

and this

generally yes, you can start younger with very supervised training that consists mostly of gun safety and a little bit of shooting. Obv some kids mature faster but yeah 9-10 seems about the age that they can fully comprehend what they are doing.

At what age do you get knighted into the neighborhood watch program and get to shoot black kids with skittles?

Because most minorities have access to those resources...

That's why there's a disproportionate number of minorities in jails.

b

Yes, the poor ones don't have access to those resources, not because of their race, but because lower class people tend to be poor.

I already covered this: http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/41...l#post32067428

Your coverage falls pretty short. Yay, you made a scenario. Class is a factor, primarily when considering within a race. Yes, the lower the class one is the more likely they would be to be arrested/convicted. Given that, minorities are still more likely to be convicted within that class. Sorry, you cannot discount race overall when comparing races to each other within a class.

http://www.cga.ct.gov/2008/rpt/2008-R-0008.htm


b

Maybe the court system is made up disproportionately causasion people, and the drug war arrests a disproportionate number of minorities?

That's my theory (based on experience). And sure, income plays a factor because Public Pretenders (Defenders) don't give two craps.

It's not set up to be racist, it's just the psychological subconscious factors that cause minorities to get longer sentences and more convictions.


And as far as kids getting shot...more kids die from swimming pools than guns in the USA if I'm not mistaken. I know guns only kill like 11-13K people from murder a year in the USA, and there are 100,000,000 legal gun owners, and 200,000,000 guns. Ignoring that over 75% of gun murders are commited by criminals, we see that like 1/100th of a percent of legal gun owners kill people...or 1/200th of a percent roughly of all guns.

In a country of 300+ million people a lot of tragedy happens...that's no reason to be anti-something. You have to put it in perspective. Just looking at the 11-13k a year seems like a large number...

...but the flu kills 33,000 Americans a year. 15,000 arthritis patients alone die of asprin and other anti-inflammatories. I'm pretty sure game theory would dictate based on "mutually assured destruction" (on a smaller level than nukes obviously) that the deterent factor of guns saves more lives than they take. A rapist with a knife will defeat a woman with a knife 9 times out of ten....the same can't be said of mutual arms with guns.

And EVEN IF guns are a net loss to life (which I contend isn't true), is it worth ending the freedoms of 99.989% of gun owners for what .011% do? (And that .011% is based on omiting the fact over 75% of gun murders are caused by criminals...so it's giving the anti-gun argument the benfit of the doubt.)

I'm anti-NRA, BTW...so please don't ad hom me on that.

It's called institutionalized racism and it's alive and well.

That said, you're right that it isn't set up to be racist. That doesn't mean it's not racist in practice(i can grant that a lot of it is unconscious). But that doesn't mean change the laws either. However, changes in procedure can help.

I think pub defenders would give a crap if they didn't have 200+ cases a day and were properly compensated. Many get about 5-10 mins of consulting with their appointed client before a hearing really makes our justice system look like a joke right out of the gate.

Anyways, back to the topic:

I agree with this. I think there's a lot of knee jerk reacting going on as if it's an epidemic sweeping everywhere. The laws being proposed seem like simple feel-good laws that aren't really going to change anything. Sometimes accidents happen. Sometimes the come in unrelated groups. It's not a sign of the apocalypse.

But it is good for agenda and redirecting (political)issues that may have gotten too hot, or too much scrutiny at the time.

b

I agree, it is institutionalized racism. The scary thing about this type of racism is it happens w/o any particular person in the chain of events in the institution acting on racist motives. It's the collective actions based on psychology the whole way that add up to racist results. And if the results are racist, it doesn't matter what the motives are.

I'd say it means change the laws and the procedure/population of those in the institution. It needa more turnover to reflect population, not so much quotas based on race, imho.

I say the law should change because it's tyranny to begin with..telling adults what they can put in their body, how tyrannical can you get? The minority of drug users are addicts, and the minority of addicts commit crimes to fund their habits. So why police EVERYONE for what a tiny minority do? Plus, line up incarceration rates of minorities for nonviolent drug crime, and the illegitimacy rates in those communities (hard to be a at-home dad from a cell). This coupled with incentives of the welfare system to put men out of the home to get a check causes a tipping point in social norms that give black children in this country 70% illegitimacy rates.

The drug war is stripping men out of families. If you end it, you stop putting 50% of the people in prison there...meaning we'll be locking up violent criminals more than 50% and nonviolent less than 50%. I'm kind of tired of child molesters and rapists getting out because of overcrowding...and yet weed dealers are in jail.

As far a public pretenders...I don't disagree with you. But some don't care. For example, I had a friend with us at a party all night. He has nymerous witnesses that he never left the party. They picked him up in the driveway and arrested him for car theft. The so-called accomplices were folks who didn't even speak the same language as us. They got reduced sentences (probation) for saying he was the driver who apparently got away...

...the problem? The police claimed he fled on foot to where he was arrested at the party. He and the other gentlemen they arrested (they pinned it on two innocent people) could NOT of went that distance in that time, according to the dash cam times. To move that distance in that time they would have had to be faster runners than the Olympic world record holder. The other guy who was arrested (not our friend) had an artifical hip from a previous accident years ago. He couldn't even run.

They both got 2 years in prison for grand theft auto.

I asked the public pretender in the elevator after the sentencing "How the **** did you lose that case?" He refused to speak or even look at me. The son of a bitch just didn't try. My firend lost on appeals (how I don't know). He served the 2 years (his second 2 years stint for a crime he didn't commit) and came home. All is well now...except our faith in the government system of justice.

I don't fully blame the pretender...but he certainly failed to uphold his duties.

I agree with your analysis of the gun situation too.

Stop using the word "racist" improperly please. The criminal justice system despite it's discriminatory nature is still a system and can not "hate" anything.

Hate isn't a necessary component of racism, and systems can indeed be racist. I do think that calling our criminal justice system is stretching the meaning of the word racism, and discriminatory is a better fit for this situation.

Why draw the line at guns? Why not knives, cars when the kids are 16 but not yet 18, pools for drowning? The NRA is one of the only groups stopping Obama and his administration from completely taking away our fundamental rights.

You better not let your guard down either. I heard Obama creeps around in the night waiting to swoop down and snatch the guns like a familiar.

They released the tapes in the dude shot the kid with the Skittles incident. If this dude doesn't get arrested for something soon a race riot is gonna hit.

http://www.myfoxorlando.com/dpp/news/seminole_news/031612-911-calls-released-in-Sanford-shooting

This is the one where the black kid is screaming for help while the neighborhood watch guy chases him down?

The more I read about this story, the more I question how it ended up in a gun thread instead of an LOLRacism thread.

Yes. They said they were not going to release the tapes until the investigation was over but they relented to public pressure. Dude is claiming lolself defense. I really don't see anyway he can get away without being arrested.

The first 911 operator told Zimmerman to stay put. He ignored this request and a boy died because of it. Along with the statement that "these *******s always get away" its pretty obvious he was out to confront the kid.


How can this guy, Zimmerman claim self-defense when the confrontation was initiated by Zimmerman?

Idiot with a gun shoots a unarmed kid with a gun. Yay guns!