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"Grammar" and "Punctuation" nit's unite! You're "head" will literally explode!

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05-12-2015 , 05:18 PM

#5401

NewOldGuy

Pooh-Bah

Join Date: Mar 2009 Posts: 5,935

It isn't a matter of grammar, as the plain sentence is neutral on that point. But absent clarifying information I think most people would assume the rest are the same.

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05-12-2015 , 07:00 PM

#5402

W0X0F

sit back, relax, and enjoy the flight

Join Date: Nov 2008 Posts: 5,853

I wouldn't.

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05-13-2015 , 01:39 AM

#5403

ArcticKnight

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Aug 2007 Posts: 21,574

Quote:

Originally Posted by DOOM@ALL_CAPS

Question on this statement to the grammar nits:

"There are 9 balls and one is heavier than the rest."

Does this imply the other 8 weigh the same amount?

Yes.

The way I look at it is that if the balls all had different weights, there would be no need to note that one was heavier than the rest, because it would be evident.

I cant imagine a situation in which, with 9 balls with different weights, a person would need to create a sentence to clarify that one of the 9 was the heaviest.

So, with that said, the only way this sentence is logical, is if all the other eight balls weigh the same.

If all the balls had different weights one would say that "ball x is the heaviest of the nine balls."

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05-13-2015 , 07:43 AM

#5404

ChrisV

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Jul 2004 Posts: 40,336

Quote:

Originally Posted by DOOM@ALL_CAPS

Question on this statement to the grammar nits:

"There are 9 balls and one is heavier than the rest."

Does this imply the other 8 weigh the same amount?

That's the implication, but it's not a guarantee.

Quote:

Originally Posted by ArcticKnight

Yes.

The way I look at it is that if the balls all had different weights, there would be no need to note that one was heavier than the rest, because it would be evident.

I think the implication is that the odd ball out is unusually heavy and the others are all much of a muchness, but not necessarily identical. If I said "there are 9 women in my book club and one is hotter than the others" the implication is that the others are roughly interchangeable. But I'm not saying they're all the exact same.

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05-13-2015 , 07:44 AM

#5405

ChrisV

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Jul 2004 Posts: 40,336

And obviously it's grammatically fine to say it even if they're all different weights, but it's an odd choice of phrasing if so, for the reasons ArcticKnight posted.

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05-13-2015 , 10:26 AM

#5406

Didace

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Nov 2009 Posts: 20,465

The only place I would expect to see a sentence like that would be in a logic problem where I would assume nothing. All we know is that one ball is "heavier than the rest". We know nothing additional about the remaining balls.

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05-13-2015 , 02:25 PM

#5407

Headhunter13

grinder

Join Date: Oct 2005 Posts: 458

Quote:

Originally Posted by ChrisV

And obviously it's grammatically fine to say it even if they're all different weights, but it's an odd choice of phrasing if so, for the reasons ArcticKnight posted.

Is it still fine to say it this way if the balls are of different weight? When you say "ball x is heavier than the rest" you're using the comparative and comparing two things, x and the rest. Since you're only comparing two things, I would think this implies the rest are all the same weight. If they are all of different weights, then one would be the heaviest (comparing all 9 balls), rather than heavier.

Is this distinction of using the comparative with two items and the superlative with three or more no longer used?

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05-14-2015 , 03:36 AM

#5408

Dominic

Tripod

Join Date: Jun 2004 Posts: 75,387

It's a grammatically fine sentence, it's just unclear.

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05-15-2015 , 01:02 AM

#5409

COG

old hand

Join Date: Apr 2012 Posts: 1,728

Biweekly is this twice a week or once every two weeks? Same with biannually, twice a year or every two years?

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05-15-2015 , 02:48 AM

#5410

Dominic

Tripod

Join Date: Jun 2004 Posts: 75,387

It's every two weeks/years. But it should be twice a week/year, dammit.

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05-15-2015 , 08:26 AM

#5411

NewOldGuy

Pooh-Bah

Join Date: Mar 2009 Posts: 5,935

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dominic

It's every two weeks/years. But it should be twice a week/year, dammit.

The term for that is semi-weekly and semi-annually.

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05-18-2015 , 03:33 AM

#5412

soah

Unexpected

Join Date: Jun 2004 Posts: 61,666

UBC student writes 52,438 word architecture dissertation with no punctuation

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05-23-2015 , 12:26 AM

#5413

steve1238

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Jan 2008 Posts: 7,631

I tried to find the answer, but why is starting a sentence with, "don't you," acceptable?

Don't (do not) you think this should be incorrect?

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05-23-2015 , 12:37 AM

#5414

ninetynine99

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Oct 2004 Posts: 8,832

Quote:

Originally Posted by soah

UBC student writes 52,438 word architecture dissertation with no punctuation

I know this guy. Seems too gimmicky/try-hard/pseudo-artsy-intellectual to me...

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05-23-2015 , 11:28 AM

#5415

metsandfinsfan

banned

Join Date: Jan 2006 Posts: 160,445

Quote:

Originally Posted by steve1238

I tried to find the answer, but why is starting a sentence with, "don't you," acceptable?

Don't (do not) you think this should be incorrect?

I suppose it is idiomatically interpretted as do you not

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05-25-2015 , 12:57 AM

#5416

smrk2

veteran

Join Date: May 2012 Posts: 3,120

Adapted from this week's Silicon Valley (hbo show):

1) We will hire whomever is best for the job (correct)

2) We will hire whom is best for the job (also correct? sounds nasty)

3) We will hire the person whom is best for the job (also correct? slight improvement over 2 but still ickily pedantic)

4) We will hire him whom is best for the job (wtf?)

5) We will hire he who is best for the job (must be incorrect but sounds like I've heard this form before)

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05-25-2015 , 11:39 AM

#5417

Zeno

Le Misanthrope

Join Date: Sep 2002 Posts: 22,617

Quote:

Originally Posted by smrk2

All incorrect.

This is correct:

We will hire the hot babe with the best body.

Cease being "ickily pedantic".

Quote

05-25-2015 , 11:42 AM

#5418

Zeno

Le Misanthrope

Join Date: Sep 2002 Posts: 22,617

Don't you know to never let grammar be a roadblock to salubrious, fun, and witty writing.

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06-30-2015 , 10:18 PM

#5419

joel2006

old hand

Join Date: Jan 2004 Posts: 1,625

Is it normal to use an opening quotation mark but not a closing one? This is really annoying, as you have to guess where the quote ends and the text begins.

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06-30-2015 , 10:47 PM

#5420

NewOldGuy

Pooh-Bah

Join Date: Mar 2009 Posts: 5,935

Quote:

Originally Posted by joel2006

Is it normal to use an opening quotation mark but not a closing one? This is really annoying, as you have to guess where the quote ends and the text begins.

If you saw this it's a typo or oversight. It isn't normal or correct in any context anywhere.

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07-01-2015 , 08:48 AM

#5421

JackInDaCrak

Just Another Dopamine Pump

Join Date: Dec 2006 Posts: 9,238

Quote:

Originally Posted by NewOldGuy

If you saw this it's a typo or oversight. It isn't normal or correct in any context anywhere.

Multiple consecutive paragraphs from the same speaker use this convention.

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07-01-2015 , 09:29 AM

#5422

joel2006

old hand

Join Date: Jan 2004 Posts: 1,625

Quote:

Originally Posted by JackInDaCrak

Multiple consecutive paragraphs from the same speaker use this convention.

Are you saying the first paragraph would have the opening quotation mark and there wouldn't be a closing one? How do you know which is the last paragraph in the quote?

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07-01-2015 , 09:58 AM

#5423

NewOldGuy

Pooh-Bah

Join Date: Mar 2009 Posts: 5,935

Quote:

Originally Posted by JackInDaCrak

Multiple consecutive paragraphs from the same speaker use this convention.

No, there is still a closing quotation mark required at the end. And the convention for quoting multiple paragraphs is to indent them so the full block is obvious.

Quote

07-01-2015 , 12:05 PM

#5424

Didace

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Nov 2009 Posts: 20,465

Quote:

Originally Posted by joel2006

Are you saying the first paragraph would have the opening quotation mark and there wouldn't be a closing one? How do you know which is the last paragraph in the quote?

The last paragraph has the closing quotation mark.

Quote:

Originally Posted by NewOldGuy

No, there is still a closing quotation mark required at the end. And the convention for quoting multiple paragraphs is to indent them so the full block is obvious.

That's not the way I learned it. Not for a conversational quote.

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07-01-2015 , 01:11 PM

#5425

NewOldGuy

Pooh-Bah

Join Date: Mar 2009 Posts: 5,935

Quote:

Originally Posted by Didace

The last paragraph has the closing quotation mark.
...

That's not the way I learned it. Not for a conversational quote.

We agree that for multi-paragraph quoting you put the closing mark after the last paragraph only. That's standard. But to indicate continued quoting within the multiple paragraphs, you are probably referring to using another opening quote at the beginning of each paragraph. I prefer block quoting instead. The rule of thumb is for more than 40 words. But if I have two paragraphs to quote, I'm using an indented block. But to be clear, I'm not referring to dialog (as a character in a book) either, which has its own rules.

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