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Legal sidewalk picketing in front of Adelson's hotels & Federal/State buildings. Legal sidewalk picketing in front of Adelson's hotels & Federal/State buildings.

03-13-2015 , 05:24 PM
Protesting outside the casino/hotels will do absolutely nothing except piss off a ton of tourists trying to enjoy their vacation. Let me tell you about the common people, they do not care about you and/or your current "plight" especially when it's not threatening their every day life.

Also, paying people to protest? Good luck with that. Adelson has ~35 billion dollars (give or take a few billion). Adelson can keep you common folk locked out of online poker for numerous decades (let's say 1 million for every house member. That's 535 million a year. And we're not even counting the fact that he doesn't have to rely on a good half of them to pay for their vote). Even if he pays every house member 1 million for their vote his way, even after 20 years, that's "only" 10 billion. 10 billion, for 20 years, to keep the drownings of you players. Also, since Adelson is 80ish, let's give him 20 more years to live (even though he should die today imo), If he paid that 10 billion, the rest of his life, he could set up a will to sell his assets and keep you players locked for the next 60 years.

You want to know how to get online poker back in the USA, legalized and regulated? The same way you get any real solutions. Revolution.

Good luck.
Legal sidewalk picketing in front of Adelson's hotels & Federal/State buildings. Quote
03-13-2015 , 07:10 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by everydaygrind
Protesting outside the casino/hotels will do absolutely nothing except piss off a ton of tourists trying to enjoy their vacation. Let me tell you about the common people, they do not care about you and/or your current "plight" especially when it's not threatening their every day life...
So then you don't believe people who vacation in Las Vegas care about national issues dealing with gambling. I would disagree, I think they are the perfect audience to try to reach and educate about national gambling issues.

Now if Adelson owned Disneyland and we were picketing that, then I think you'd have an argument.

Last edited by Well Read Ted; 03-13-2015 at 07:16 PM.
Legal sidewalk picketing in front of Adelson's hotels & Federal/State buildings. Quote
03-14-2015 , 01:32 PM
Perhaps one of the picket signs could read:

"Give me liberty or give me the Venetian (death)!"

Nonetheless, I like the OP's idea. Nothing to lose at this point and all upside if anything is to come from this. Like the OP said, at the very least, even if it doesn't garner the attention we want, it will be at least be an annoyance if not worse for Adelson himself and the hotel visitors who go there as his customers, especially the ones who visit only once during the whole year. They should probably find it more than a mere annoyance (aka major pain the arse). And I am sure there are plenty of those patrons who will complain that they never expected to see such unwanted "blight" in front of their resort hotel while trying to enjoy their time at this vacation spot. What do you think Yelp and Amazon reviews are for? The people will be texting away to at least stay at some other resort.

Last edited by HurtLocker; 03-14-2015 at 01:40 PM.
Legal sidewalk picketing in front of Adelson's hotels & Federal/State buildings. Quote
03-14-2015 , 02:46 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gzesh
Are you sure of your facts ? (The performer got a settlement versus Metro, The Con Law claims v the Venetian were dismissed. Not sure about the State Law claims.)

First Amendment speech likely cannot be excluded from that space .....As part of the street performer litigation the US District Court ruled regarding the Venetian sidewalk and public access:

"This Court and the Ninth Circuit made clear ten years ago that as "a thoroughfare sidewalk, seamlessly connected to public sidewalks at either end and intended for general public use," the sidewalk in front of the Venetian is a public sidewalk, and consequently, a traditional public forum from which Venetian Defendants have no right to exclude members of the public. Venetian Casino Resort, L.L.C., 257 F.3d at 948. "

Perez-Morciglio v. Las Vegas Metropolitan Police, 820 F. Supp. 2d 1100 (D. Nev. 2011)

So, one or even two protestors could likely picket, and maybe get detained/harassed/ ... but not lawfully detained and harassed.

This is NOT a legal opinion, nor advice, It is just a discussion posted generally in this forum. I also do not think this is productive way to create dialogue with possible opponents of RAWA.

(I am a lawyer, but not your lawyer.) .... You should check with your lawyer or contact the ACLU before protesting ???
Go walk between the sidewalk fencing of the Venetian and if you see anyone there handing out a flyer, dressed in a cartoon character outfit, break dancing with a bucket for a tips post the picture on this board. My guess is it's never going to happen. The Venetian and Palazzo agreed with city to maintain their sidewalks. The other casinos didn't agree. They are not necessarily private property which means anyone can pass in front of the casino going from point A to point B. If you set up shop on those sidewalk areas security will come out and encourage you to leave. They can do it under a number of guises. Safety reasons, harassing tourists who are trying to walk. People in cartoon outfits can't ask for tips to take their picture but they try hard to get you to give them something. As I said the porn slappers stay just outside the Venetian property. If they weren't getting hassled then explain why they stay off the property. You can't walk 5 feet on the Strip without one of those cretins sticking something in your face.
Legal sidewalk picketing in front of Adelson's hotels & Federal/State buildings. Quote
03-14-2015 , 03:10 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by News777
Go walk between the sidewalk fencing of the Venetian and if you see anyone there handing out a flyer, dressed in a cartoon character outfit, break dancing with a bucket for a tips post the picture on this board. My guess is it's never going to happen. The Venetian and Palazzo agreed with city to maintain their sidewalks. The other casinos didn't agree. They are not necessarily private property which means anyone can pass in front of the casino going from point A to point B. If you set up shop on those sidewalk areas security will come out and encourage you to leave...
They can encourage all they want but they can't do anything to stop you unless they and the Venetian wants to get sued.

http://www.firstamendmentcenter.org/...ls-panel-rules
Legal sidewalk picketing in front of Adelson's hotels & Federal/State buildings. Quote
03-14-2015 , 03:27 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Well Read Ted
They can encourage all they want but they can't do anything to stop you unless they and the Venetian wants to get sued.

http://www.firstamendmentcenter.org/...ls-panel-rules
Apparently no one is challenging the Venetian. I have a theory that the costumed performers and porn slappers don't even have Green Cards. Many of them are here illegally. Your better off staying off the property if you have an outstanding warrant or snuck into the US. Anywhere else on the Strip you don't have to deal with security guards or LE.
Legal sidewalk picketing in front of Adelson's hotels & Federal/State buildings. Quote
03-14-2015 , 08:11 PM
Not a lawyer, but there is a difference between a street performer and someone who is protesting about the actions of the Venetian or their owner.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nevada State Law
NRS 614.160 Picketing: Unlawful acts; acceptable acts; local variance; penalty.

1. During the pendency of a strike, work stoppage or other dispute, it is unlawful for any person:

(a) To picket on private property without the written permission of the owner or pursuant to an order from a federal court or agency of competent jurisdiction, even if the private property is open to the public as invitees for business, except that an employee may enter or leave his or her employer's property in the course of his or her employment or for the purpose of receiving payment for services performed;

(b) To maintain any picket or picket line, individually or as part of a group, in front of or across entrances to or exits from any property, except that the following numbers of pickets may be maintained across entrances or exits if the pickets do not narrow or block the entrances or exits or delay, impede or interfere with the ability of persons or vehicles to enter or leave the property
Pretty sure security won't hesitate holding you inside until the police arrive.
Legal sidewalk picketing in front of Adelson's hotels & Federal/State buildings. Quote
03-15-2015 , 05:41 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by venice10
Not a lawyer, but there is a difference between a street performer and someone who is protesting about the actions of the Venetian or their owner.

Pretty sure security won't hesitate holding you inside until the police arrive.
Lol, I'd love for a Venetian security officer to hold me inside for just walking on the sidewalk in front of the Venetian with a picket sign. I'd probably make more money from a lawsuit than I'd ever make playing poker.

You might have missed this from the link in post 80 which is from the website "First Amendment Center" Vanderbilt University:

Quote:
Headline: Protesters can use casino’s sidewalk, federal appeals panel rules

Associated Press
Wire Report
Tuesday, July 17, 2001

LAS VEGAS, Nev. — A federal appeals court panel's ruling that protesters have the right to use a privately owned sidewalk in front of a Las Vegas Strip resort has First Amendment implications statewide, a civil rights group says.

The 9th U.S. Circuit Court of Appeals on July 12 upheld a Las Vegas U.S. District Court judge's decision granting unions access to the sidewalks in front of the Venetian resort. The American Civil Liberties Union of Nevada litigated the case.

“We regard this as a very big victory, probably one of the biggest the ACLU of Nevada has won in the courts,” said Nevada ACLU President Richard Siegel of Reno. “It was a solid affirmation of free-expression rights and a broad interpretation of the concept of public access...”

http://www.firstamendmentcenter.org/...ls-panel-rules
I'm not a lawyer but my interpretation of what you brought in post 82 is that you can't picket on the area "inside" the sidewalk on the Venetian property or you can't intentionally block people (from your position on the sidewalk) from going from the sidewalk to the Venetian hotel entry path.

In my opinion (once again I'm not a lawyer) from what I'm reading is that there is no way they can do anything to you if you're just walking back and forth on the sidewalk with a picket sign and not trying to block anyone.

Also, It might be a good idea to call the ACLU, or the Las Vegas Culinary Union who has many years of experience in picketing Vegas hotels. I'd also have a friend with a camera phone to record everything anytime a security officer came anywhere near me or other picketers.

Last edited by Well Read Ted; 03-15-2015 at 06:08 AM.
Legal sidewalk picketing in front of Adelson's hotels & Federal/State buildings. Quote
03-15-2015 , 08:57 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by GiveMe Liberty
Also, I want to say that I don’t live in Nevada and I don’t plan on visiting there any time soon. But I would send financial help if a fundraising site was set up by a trusted individual to buy signs and flyers. So if this thing is going to get off the ground it’s probably going to either take a passionate Vegas local to organize things or maybe some wealthy individual to buy about 15 signs to use. The best thing that could happen is if some poker big name or entertainment
celebrity stepped up to the plate and got involved.
Would Guy Laliberte get involved?
Legal sidewalk picketing in front of Adelson's hotels & Federal/State buildings. Quote
03-16-2015 , 07:38 AM
Looks like there is an interesting history of picketing and legal issues at the Venetian. Lol, it says a security guard at the Venetian made a citizens arrest.

https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/...messages/25499

I believe that means he acted on his own volition and not as a agent of the Venetian. In my opinion some Venetian lawyer probably came up with that strategy. Can you believe this guy Adelson.
Legal sidewalk picketing in front of Adelson's hotels & Federal/State buildings. Quote
03-16-2015 , 10:20 AM
Quote:
he did not find it unusual for Las Vegas police to issue permits for a demonstration that might interfere with public access to a casino
Which might imply a permit is necessary, but not excessively difficult to obtain.
Legal sidewalk picketing in front of Adelson's hotels & Federal/State buildings. Quote
03-16-2015 , 04:31 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by VP$IP
Which might imply a permit is necessary, but not excessively difficult to obtain.
I wouldn't think you would need a permit just to hand out leaflets/flyers. Here is what a Los Angeles Times article by Matt Assad says:

"At one point, Adelson even fought to keep culinary union workers from leafleting on the public sidewalk outside the Venetian. When police and local courts told him he couldn't, he spent eight years appealing the ruling to the U.S. Supreme Court before giving up."

http://articles.latimes.com/2012/jun...union-20120602
Legal sidewalk picketing in front of Adelson's hotels & Federal/State buildings. Quote
03-16-2015 , 06:22 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Well Read Ted
I wouldn't think you would need a permit just to hand out leaflets/flyers. Here is what a Los Angeles Times article by Matt Assad says:

"At one point, Adelson even fought to keep culinary union workers from leafleting on the public sidewalk outside the Venetian. When police and local courts told him he couldn't, he spent eight years appealing the ruling to the U.S. Supreme Court before giving up."

http://articles.latimes.com/2012/jun...union-20120602
Just goes to show how relentless and ruthless this billionaire really is. It is about the retention of as much POWER as possible. I would venture that for a while now, money is just a pure way of how Adelson keeps score now. That is why he spends it like water for influence in Washington DC politics above and beyond all other billionaires out there.
Legal sidewalk picketing in front of Adelson's hotels & Federal/State buildings. Quote
03-17-2015 , 03:39 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by lookinforfish2
I think it is a good idea, and has a chance of getting some media attention, especially if done for a prolonged period of time.

The only issue I see is maybe if the sidewalks are their property and they could have you removed or charged with trespassing.
If we are to believe the US Court of Appeals it is legal

Quote:
The 9th U.S. Circuit Court of Appeals on July 12 upheld a Las Vegas U.S. District Court judge's decision granting unions access to the sidewalks in front of the Venetian resort.

http://www.firstamendmentcenter.org/...ls-panel-rules
Quote:
Originally Posted by lookinforfish2
..maybe if it was done on the casino adjacent to them it would be OK. Heck.. the neighboring casinos would probably be happy to have you do that as maybe they get a little extra business from it.
Yeah, if you don't want to chance some legal loophole the Venetian might use, all you would have to do is picket a few feet south of the Venetian sidewalk where there is still a huge amount of pedestrian traffic of people on their way to the Venetian. The people would still know you were picketing the Venetian if the wording "Venetian" was on your sign somewhere (even though you were not technically on Venetian property).

Also there is a McDonalds right up an escalator in that area that is not on the Venetian property. You could picket a half hour, then take a break at McDonalds, then come back and picket some more.
Legal sidewalk picketing in front of Adelson's hotels & Federal/State buildings. Quote
03-19-2015 , 06:03 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by GiveMe Liberty
11 reasons to picket the Venetian and Palazzo hotels.


1) Will get our cause more publicized especially if news stories of the picketing start appearing in the newspapers, on TV, and in social media.

2) Could cost the “Las Vegas Sands Inc.” money if some people do indeed not gamble or stay at the Venetian and Palazzo after reading the flyers, the signs, and after talking to picketers. The “Las Vegas Sands Inc” is a publicly traded company (of which Adelson is a founder and CEO) and owns the Venetian and Palazzo hotel/casinos.

3) Could hurt the reputation of the Venetian and Palazzo causing less people to stay there in the future.

4) If the reputation of the Venetian and Palazzo starts to decline as our cause and efforts becomes more publicized, and if less people start gambling and staying there, this imo will definitely hurt the stock price of Sands Inc.. Adelson is so rich he might not care much but the other stockholders at the Sands Inc. will care because it will affect them.

5) Sands Inc. stockholders could start complaining to Adelson about his actions due to reason #4.

6) Poker players’ morale and feeling of unity will increase if more players, poker celebrities, and possibly even entertainment celebrities become involved in the protesting and picketing.

7) Vegas tourists are for the most part people who like to gamble. If more of them learn about Adelson and what he is up to, it could piss them off and more people will join and support our cause. Remember Adelson’s actions will not only hurt poker players who like to play on the net but also people who like other forms of gambling and would like to play those games on the net.

8) If Adelson’s reputation starts to decline with more people, then more politicians and other casino owners might try to distance themselves from him no matter how much money he has.

9) If other casino owners like Steve Wynn see picketers at the Venetian and Palazzo, they might begin realize that they too will be taking risks by supporting Adelson’s agenda.

10) Adelson himself might begin to realize there is some risk to the reputation of the “Las Vegas Sands Inc.” because of his actions. As of today, he probably has seen little risk. But a highly visible picketing movement in front of his Venetian (even an on again off again picketing movement over time) might change all of that as the public becomes more aware of what’s going on. Of course at 81 yrs. old he might not care, but once again the Sands Inc. stockholders will surely care about the future reputation of the Venetian and Palazzo. A company’s reputation (and brand name) is very important and most executives know that. The stockholders wouldn’t want the Venetian and Palazzo’s names to be tarnished. That could cost them money.

11) Picketers, and financial supporters of the picketing, would at least be trying something new. This might make them feel a little better after having a game they’ve enjoyed and loved for years to be suddenly and without warning snatched out from under them by mostly unseen forces on tax day April 15.
There's another reason that out-of-towners and Vegas history buffs might enjoy:

Any picketing that would be done on the Venetian sidewalk would take place on the exact spot where the rat pack was standing in the first photo on this web page:

http://www.pophistorydig.com/topics/...tra-1958-1960/
Legal sidewalk picketing in front of Adelson's hotels & Federal/State buildings. Quote
03-19-2015 , 11:36 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Well Read Ted
There's another reason that out-of-towners and Vegas history buffs might enjoy:

Any picketing that would be done on the Venetian sidewalk would take place on the exact spot where the rat pack was standing in the first photo on this web page:

http://www.pophistorydig.com/topics/...tra-1958-1960/
Nice, except they are sitting down.

Try this one

http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2011/...39_634x852.jpg

Last edited by Gzesh; 03-19-2015 at 11:51 AM.
Legal sidewalk picketing in front of Adelson's hotels & Federal/State buildings. Quote
03-20-2015 , 07:37 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Koko the munkey
I like those signs but to be more realistic get rid of the trees and put 100 tourists in the background. Maybe also put a picture of Adelson in there giving you the eye.

Also imagine 20 people with signs like those in front of the Venetian.
Legal sidewalk picketing in front of Adelson's hotels & Federal/State buildings. Quote
03-24-2015 , 02:14 AM
If you're not the picketing type then tweet; the very important RAWA Congressional hearing is in less than 2 days (on Wednesday).

http://theppa.org/fight-hr707/
Legal sidewalk picketing in front of Adelson's hotels & Federal/State buildings. Quote
03-26-2015 , 04:11 AM
It's a shame that so many poker player support sheldon adelson internet poker views by playing in his casino. Don't they care about poker? There are plenty of other rooms in Las Vegas.
Legal sidewalk picketing in front of Adelson's hotels & Federal/State buildings. Quote
03-26-2015 , 07:26 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gopher22
It's a shame that so many poker player support sheldon adelson internet poker views by playing in his casino. Don't they care about poker? There are plenty of other rooms in Las Vegas.
I don't gamble at the Venetian or Palazzo and don't plan to because Adelson's actions, but I would think just because a poker player chooses to play at the Venetian doesn't necessarily mean they support Adelson's agenda. He/she might think they can make more money there. There's always going to be "scabs" (as picket line crossers are called) with any picketing/protest movement.

Although I support a boycott, I think a sustained picketing campaign in front of the Venetian could get more media attention. And put more pressure on the Sands Inc. stockholders, who will be concerned about the Venetian and Palazzo's image.

Last edited by Well Read Ted; 03-26-2015 at 07:38 AM.
Legal sidewalk picketing in front of Adelson's hotels & Federal/State buildings. Quote
04-02-2015 , 07:56 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gopher22
It's a shame that so many poker player support sheldon adelson internet poker views by playing in his casino. Don't they care about poker? There are plenty of other rooms in Las Vegas.
My concern with statements like this is they emphasize avoiding the poker room too much. Poker players play machines, they play games like craps, roulette, etc., and they spend money on food, rooms and entertainment. They don't just play poker. If all Adelson hears is "We're not playing in your room," that could encourage his actions if he holds the belief that taking out the room and adding in slot machines could make him more money.
Legal sidewalk picketing in front of Adelson's hotels & Federal/State buildings. Quote
04-03-2015 , 05:50 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve00007
My concern with statements like this is they emphasize avoiding the poker room too much. Poker players play machines, they play games like craps, roulette, etc., and they spend money on food, rooms and entertainment. They don't just play poker. If all Adelson hears is "We're not playing in your room," that could encourage his actions if he holds the belief that taking out the room and adding in slot machines could make him more money.
Actually I've heard the reason many hotels have poker rooms is not because of the money the poker room makes but because many high rollers and other gamblers won't stay at a hotel that doesn't have a poker room (even though they might play craps and blackjack more than poker). They like to have that option of playing some poker if they are in the mood.
Legal sidewalk picketing in front of Adelson's hotels & Federal/State buildings. Quote
04-03-2015 , 11:27 AM
im currently in thailand and not allowed in the USA cuz i got caught with weed in canada, but im down to support this

How do i go about that? i will pay someone to picket for me
Legal sidewalk picketing in front of Adelson's hotels & Federal/State buildings. Quote
04-03-2015 , 07:58 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Well Read Ted
Actually I've heard the reason many hotels have poker rooms is not because of the money the poker room makes but because many high rollers and other gamblers won't stay at a hotel that doesn't have a poker room (even though they might play craps and blackjack more than poker). They like to have that option of playing some poker if they are in the mood.
But some have the belief that those players will sometimes lose their money to poker players instead of to the casino, and as a result they frown on having poker in their casinos.
Legal sidewalk picketing in front of Adelson's hotels & Federal/State buildings. Quote
04-04-2015 , 05:34 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve00007
But some have the belief that those players will sometimes lose their money to poker players instead of to the casino, and as a result they frown on having poker in their casinos.
Yeah, but those players might choose not to stay at the hotel if it didn't have a poker room so the hotel loses out on the room rate plus losses at any other table games they might play besides poker.
Legal sidewalk picketing in front of Adelson's hotels & Federal/State buildings. Quote

      
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