I'm not following, so it's OK for the casino to give out cards and imply there are patterns in baccarat that in a random deck would not exist but if someone actually finds a pattern that the casino has implied is there and takes advantage of it then it is dishonest?

judge says players didnt do anything wrong, has to pay the players

Or just that they didn't do anything illegal? I haven't read the judgement.

I'm not sure how you got there from what I said Denks.

I still don't know how Baccarat works and I refuse to google (it should only be understood by cads and James Bond imo) but no, a casino shouldn't try to persuade customers that something is true if they know it isn't.

Equally I think we can distinguish between a player who has been convinced that patterns exist and bets when they believe they have found one and a player who can predict the fall of the cards because they realise the deck hasn't been shuffled.

If the casino thinks it is offering a game of chance and you know it isn't and you know the casino wouldn't continue to offer the game under those circumstances then it seems to me wrong to exploit them.

I have just read a summary of the court case ,it reads ....the cards are sent to the casino in a predetermined pattern which is a propriety secret...... oh you mean they are fixed.
At least the owner of the joint has come out of this with some respect and paid the punters,no doubt his legal team will be pissed off all those hours they cannot charge for,by going to appeal .Oh I forgot they are taking the manufacturers to court, happy days

Umm. Nobody's commented on the concept of relying on the card manufacturer for randomness in the first place?

The system could be hacked by a corrupt employee at the card co. Pre-stack the decks, send to casino where teammates are waiting, bob's your uncle.

Kind of skipped through but what they are saying is a bunch of Mini Bac players were looking for patterns?

RIDICULOUS!!!! :@:@:@

I mean of course they are going to try, but no, they have no shot at winning.

Patrons told the Golden Nugget to pound sand. Rejected their offer

Are you talking about Caesars? If you are, that's not quite what happened there.

Man, I dunno who is advising GNAC but they keep this **** up, they're going to get swatted in court, and the CCC is going to swat them harder afterwards.

This is really easy. If you can't protect your games or the house bankroll properly, you deserve what's coming to you. I can assure you that in NJ, the authorities will not approve of the casino blaming the players for their own ****up.

The other thing, when a player is suing a casino, and there's a jury trial, once the player gets past motion, the casino can just write the check right there. Playing hardball here is just going to aggravate GNAC's liability position. They're handling this absolutely the wrong way.

New ruling that players must return profits.
http://abcnews.go.com/Weird/wireStor...urned-28934847

The casino always wins

O/u on # of posts before someone comes here claiming the players are all scumbag cheaters and should be facing criminal charges?

I don't know about the cheater part, but most professional gamblers are scumbags.

I've looked for a copy of the Judge's order online, but can't find it anywhere. Does anyone have link or a copy they can post?

Cheaters never win!

Essentially the GN was able to introduce cold decks into the game and the ruling was that the games were not legal.

To be consistent the ruling should also have the casino refund any money that other players lost in the tainted games. The GN should also be fined for offering games that did not meet the legal requirements.

Of course, no surprise that a casino would win a case in AC.

This. If casino ran an "unauthorized" game it should be fined and penalized for doing so.

I haven't seen any discussion of this, but if these were really $10 bettors who saw a pattern (as reports stated), where'd they scare up a $5,000/hand so quickly? And, since they did, how did that not set off alarm bells in the pit??? This is obviously a bit rhetorical as management didn't pick up on cards coming out in sequence, but still....

If they were betting up to $5k a hand (maybe i misread) there most definitely was so form of pit boss watching the game and you just let 41 hands in a row go off like no big deal? How do you not fire that entire crew instantly? However, you will never ever beat a casino in a situation like this, much better off just giving cash back and moving on with your life.

Didn't see this thread 3 years ago, but the exact same thing happened in a provincial casino here in England.

Except the cards weren't supposed to be pre shuffled, it was the casino's fault.

The error was only noticed half way through an 8 deck shoe when the pit boss said "3 more hands and then we are going to shuffle the deck" LOL

The only saving grace for the company who owned the place was that it is situated outside the big cities and the limits were relatively low. Still lost about £200,000 IIRC.

Never any question of withholding payment and the only action taken was the pit boss got fired.

What "other claims" did the players make against the casino?

In that report it stated the owner offered to pay in full if the players dropped other claims.

Why on earth would they turn down this offer?

Read a report stating they sued for racial discrimination as they were all Asian.

I agree. I can't imagine any sane attorney thinking it was worth gambling the $1.5M for what? How much more could a lawsuit get them?

I just can't help but think that I would like to see casinos burn. **** em, giant parasites.

what a bunch of idits