I just looked into this ellen page thing. is incredible, esp. when looking at her(his!) before. she (he now!) got famous for her very feminine and fragile looks!

women over 40 do not get casted anymore in hollywood. men do. falling into a crisisis and not getting calls for movies for a woman is pretty much a given in hollywood.

if they do then sporadically- so this is to put it mildly very scetchy timing wise.

ellen page got hired all her life for her innocent, petite and female looks. at 5.1 height that is understandable. her presence and aura was very very female.

now to become a man is weird because it looks like a desperate attempt to be in the spotlight again. how many women transition around that age?

During your "research" you probably should have spent some time reading or listening to what the person in question actually said. They actually spent a lot of time talking about the experience and reasons for it. That isn't something you just make up to reinvent your career IMO. And regardless, your thoughts dont really match reality as the person was actually employed before and during the transition, and regardless that isn't something anyone would do just to reinvent a career.

Meh. I wish I hadn't made the last post. I dont think it is useful to tangent and focus too much on the anecdote. The anecdote isn't the point. The way tribalism and specifically disgust of "the other" works psychologically in humans (mostly disconnected from action) is the point. The anecdotes one could use to illustrate this are endless.

I did, did you? Person in question knows (as do you) their career is over around the age of 40 in hollywood. Probably sooner- Everyone knows this, just name me on actress that beat that golden rule. There are only a few, and those are the biggest, real character acrtesses. Roberts, Lauren etc.

What did she say? She just ****ed up her marriage, to a lesbian, and before that she did the same with another lesbian, and then covid hit, and she hit 40, a naturally career ending age for any hollywood actress, also with natural incresement or testosterone production for a female and declining estrogen hormon production, shortly put, AROUND THAT AGE, ONLY 2 generations earlier, people were dying of natural causes of old age. People at that age turn to look the other sex naturally, men get boobs, women get facial hair. Hormons go crazy! do you get this? A hollywood career is over for any woman at that age.


Are you sure it wouldnt be? Becuase I am seeing a very disturbed human, that cant get the roles and attention anymore, because looks are fading.


Was emplyed during and after? AS what? As a very feminine looking 5 foot woman? She was famous for that nothing else. She had cute fragile girl literally tatooed on her forehead. THat was what she was selling, Only was this not sustainable above the age of 40. Nobody buys that, do you get that?

Ah yes, now we are crapping on Elliot because maybe he transitioned in a desperate attempt to get jobs, jobs we were previously crapping on his ability to get.

Let Elliot worry about Elliot’s body.

what else is the result uke? she gets all the attention now as the spearhead of a whole movement. wheras where would she be without all this noise?
if she stayed a woman where would she be now? would be history, if you are honest.
by the way, she was always unstable, a nutcase listening to her own fans and looking at her history. transitioning will make her even more unstable imo.
she failed at marrying a woman, her relationships are in shambles, hollywood, failed her once nearing 40.
we are not crapping we are pointing out errors in your thinking. you cant alllow people to change sex when it financially suits them, or they will do it for fame and glory or to gain access in sports and anywhere.

Washoe, your transphobia is showing again.

what transphobia? Im not fearing or hating anything or anyone here.

Im just pointing out that she is a very disturbed individual according to all sources and by simply looking at her past. she was a very cute girl with problems. and now she is the tough guy, ex lesbian. I mean something is off here dont you think? figure head of a movement!


this is very different here now because:

- we know how she acted and portrayed herself as a woman.

- she is an aging actress

- her marriage to another woman has just failed. To many other women. There has to be one dominant part in a relationship, the male role. The stronger one who is right all the time. (supposely) So now she wants to take charge at the strong role. (you might want to dismiss this, but I wouldnt. People suffer and make mistakes esp. right after ending marriges/ relationships)

alone the fact that elliot page declared he is trans right when he was ending his marriage is telling.

it's so incredibly obvious what was being done just by looking at when it was done.

and if the person is really in your interest of being healthy you react differently to it.

what's been done is a mastectomy

which is done out of fear of getting breast cancer.

here it was done out of fear of exclusion from Hollywood, obviously. or to gain from "inclusion"

here you could sell a thing women do out of fear of sagging tits or breast cancer, which is surgery, around that age, as something that millions of people would cheer for the wrong reasons.

look a women's body is not able or hardly able to procreate above the age of 40. the ovaries becomes too old. menstruation stops for many women. it even dangerous to get pregnant for the child and the mother. transition then will smell to heaven as a way out, to prolong your career or whatever.

I wouldn't mind transitioning when it didn't happen at that exact threshold of time. but here it is telling.

Christina Applegate just had her breasts removed due to cancer, as she did millions of other women did it. and they look at this **** and wanna throw up, probably.

MOre lies by uke.


Again if a WNBA person transitions to male while also saying they hope to maintain pro career, that person's transition can prompt a discussion on what the NBA (male pro basketball) biases are that are INDUSTRY focused and not comments on the person specifically, despite that individual being the prompt for the discussion.

Elliot transitioning has NOTHING to do with the truthfulness or accuracy of my comments and even if no trans person was in the discussion and this was just a 5ft, 100lb man, hoping to make it in Hollywood, those comments by me could be made.

Your entire position uke is, trans people are off limits for truths and facts that i do not like and don't want to hear. You are ok, if we see an obese individual who says they plan to go into fire fighting and based on that person, I say 'firefighting discriminates against hiring the obese, at least up front' as long as that person is cis and not trans. If they are trans you scream 'STOPPPPPP', and lie and say this is me obsessing about the trans person.

No uke, stop the lies.

People who want to be firefighters who are obese, trans or not, will struggle to get that work.

Pro Basketball player in mens leagues (trans or cis) will struggle to get jobs if they are on the extremes of short.

Hollywood will have limited roles for people (trans or cis) on the margins of height extremes short or tall.


All of these are factual truisms and I could list dozens more, and if at any point a public figure who is obese, short or tall to the extremes that job prospects in their targeted industry will be hard to find, there is NOTHING wrong in discussing that. There is nothing wrong with a Trans person being the trigger for that discussion just as there would not be if it was a cis person.

So no where in here do you say what i said was wrong or even inappropriate, just that you perceived it as 'not uplifting' when you think Elliott needs support?

uke do you think Elliott is reading this forum and is seeing you defend him and you are gaining favour in his eyes?

Serious question as that entire post seems predicted on the only thing being wrong that you say I did being the lack of support at a time when Elliot may be 'down'.

And for the record, my singular comment in that regard was not intended to bring Elliott down in any way, it was simply an observation that came to me as happens when a subject is topical and Elliot's transition is topical for the reasons you mention.

Further what you call 'pleasing', is something I had said also. One of the exceptions to getting work is when a very personal aspect of the actor can be used in a story line (mirrored or biographically). We have seen people who are not even actors, bought who have had an interesting experience or story line in their lives pulled in to play a role based on that. But as I said prior (and as you will hate to hear now) that tends to be an extremely limited thing. Meaning, if you are getting your role due to that unique factor, there is little reason to believe that will continue to drive roles for you ongoing.

So because you are so intent in trying to make any such discussion off limits, because you do not LIKE the REALITY or TRUTH, I will actually do what you are accusing me of and now speculate more specifically with regards to Elliot, which is also fine to do, despite the fact you will hate it. I am doing so just to expose your reaction (incoming) that you believe no one should say things you do not like to hear and you should be able to control it and if not the person should know they will face lies and smears.

Elliot getting the role in Umbrella Academy is in no way yet suggestive of whether Hollywood (acting) more generally will accept him for roles to anywhere near the extent he got before transitioning. This could well greatly diminish his career and that would be the +EV bet imo.

And now I will give you hope uke as this discussion made me think of an outlier example that might make others take the other side of the bet. That is Asia Kate Dillon, who I know thru the TV show Billions who is a trans non binary person (? don't know if i got that exactly right) is enjoying a good career with many roles. Of course Asia is 5'7", which is likely the median (+/-1 inch) and Asia is not limited to playing 'male' roles to the degree Elliott will likely be. So I both giveth and taketh away from you.

(enter new smears and rant here '________________' )

uke before I engage in this, show me some examples of me 'pushing back on you' on topics you have not attacked, smeared and lied about my prior.

Just so we have some context by which I can answer this.

oh Hollywood is a great example, because we can all look at the person in question.

is it true or not that Ellen page is famous for being a petite cute girl on screen? she seemed to be very fine with portraying that image of herself for many years to millions of people!

she was very comfortable to be that person in front of millions. only until that didn't work anymore did she hit a brick wall. the wall of time, which nobody can beat. marriage gone to ****, no more audiences for her petite girlish looks at 40.and then?? boom make the change. pff

You think this decision was career driven? Uh, no chance.

It is not radical to expect the cops to not roll into a play ground, guns a blazing, when the person is a diminutive child, and there is no identified immediate threat (no innocents in park in danger and yet that is what this cop did.


There is no instance, where you as a legally armed citizen, who might think that kid is a threat, gets to drive up, firing as you do, without first taking the lay of the land (is there an immediate threat to others, is there a real weapon) and that you are not going away for murder if you kill that kid, in the scenario as this played out.

Only cops get to use the 'I was afraid' as a defense that is enough of a threshold. We expect citizens and soldiers in active war zones around non combatant to execute more care in first establishing the threat is real, and to only fire if they believe the threat is imminent.

Simply 'i was afraid it was a gun', when it is a cell phone or toy, is only acceptable for cops and that is wrong. They need to be held to the highest standard and not the lowest, as they are charged with 'PROTECT and SERVE', which means for all citizens.

it was the most +ev line for anyone with a personality disorder of that magnitude imo.

see how Ellen page was a prodigy child actress, yes the fame came from being an actress! and how it messed her up:

While I don't agree with washoe's take, that i only see due to it being quoted, I was surprised it escaped uke's wrath based on him stating a truism about 'women and Hollywood' and how roles diminish greatly with age.

But then I recalled uke is ok with truths being stated about any group, except for trans people. That seems to be his singular focus where he believes truth and reality should not be stated.


As I have said, Hollywood is a superficial, fickle place that discriminates based on more factors than, I think, any other industry.

washoe's point re women over 40 is not one any of us have to like but that does not make it 'not true' nor something we should not be able to acknowledge or discuss.
My point re people on the extremes of height being considered for minimal roles is not something any of us have to like, but that does not make it 'not true' nor something we should not be able to acknowledge or discuss.


uke's retort of 'i will determine in which areas reality and truth are allowed via what I think is nice or not' is sadly something, as not a mod he can enforce and he knows it. Thus why he resorts to lies, smears and intimidation tactics to try and force his way and to ensure OTHERS know not to tread in to this area. Just leave it off limits. Cancel culture technique successful!

look, I don't like this topic, but women actresses do not get casted for the same roles they used to get casted before 40. Romy Schneider for example, big movie star, hit 40 and wasn't ever seen again in public. she shut herself in and died. all women actresses start having serious mental problems, with the few exceptions.

what else is it? her last hit was in 2016 and yes it was a role as the child like elve girly super hero.

nothing happened after it, and her last gig was in 2017 in flatliners as a girl. then covid hit and her marriage failed. also another thing happened the trans movement. are those all coincidences to you? where would she be in now? not in the spotlight that much is certain.

https://m.imdb.com/name/nm0680983/?ref_=tt_cl_i_1

Really? Have you thought this through Washoe? He transitioned to be in the spotlight again even though he was already a fairly well known actor before transitioning?

oh man vc you are really slow today.

the thing she was selling was youth alright? or youthful, girlish, attravtiveness from the age of 10 she was a star alright? at some point you can't fullfill this role anymore of the Lolita type sex symbol which was her role.

get it? games over for her and her lifetime role.
time to reinvent now as it's happening imo.

Washoe, when you say "all sources" do you mean you randomly clicked on whatever you stumbled across on youtube or google? Because your sources for your Holtzclaw thread were Iraqi information minister levels of reliability in fairness.

Jasus. He transitioned because at some point you can't fullfill this role anymore of the Lolita type sex symbol?

Washoe in a weird strange way, I find you one of the most fascinating posters on this forum. I also find you rather likeable on a personal level so I swear I'm genuinely not being a smart arse asking you this, but are you by any chance a recreational drug user? It's just that sometimes you come out with the most amazing $hit I've ever read and it seems you just jump right into things in an almost stream of conscious manner so I'm honestly not trying to be disrespectful nor do I mean any offence but do you be off your tits when posting? Honestly?

no, I'm sober at the moment. thanks likewise.

is it so difficult to see for you that she grew out of the role that made her famous? and now people get desperate in that spot.

what I am seeing is an idiot who just got a divorced after 3 years of marriage. not getting the roles and attention she ia used to get and now jumping on a train to retrieve "success" feel successful again. her last movie flatliners got bad recessions. (2017)

think about it. marriage failed. movie roles? not existent. nobody wants to cast her anymore, for what? the sexy little girl she was? not maintainable above 40. she is not the only actress with that fate. but she feels like a loser now. everything failed. now she wants to charge as the man. that's not gonna solve anything imo. i hope it does but I'm critical.

I think she is addicted to fame and success. and the only way to achieve this or turn the time back is doing what is done now. they feel "love" when celebrated and attention gets brought to them. i think that's a very dangerous drug he/she is on.

Washoe sure is a special case. Like in some ways he is more egregiously transphobic than almost anyone else ITT, but he is so like almost innocently weird about it that it comes off as just parroting a line he saw in the most recent youtubez he watched, but then distorted into its own weird thing. Drugs was a decent bet.