If trolly is for showing me the door then it must be to invite me in.

Or I suppose he could just be an obsessive creepy little troll.

Good to know well named is editing down racist language in people's posts to sanitize them for more popular consumption, and then deleting the posts of people who point out the original racist language. Really doing god's work here, making alt-right content more appealing to the masses.

As a general rule, if I remove something that I think is inappropriate, I'm going to either edit or delete quotes of the inappropriate material, assuming I see them. If you have a problem with this moderation strategy, feel free to take it to the mod forum or ATF.

If this is sincere, how about you start an ATF thread open for complaints about your forum and tell Mat not to lock or interfere with it? Because otherwise, "go start a thread in ATF (where TPTB will lock it because they don't GAF)" doesn't really sound like a great option, thanks.

I can't tell the admins what to do, of course, but I've said at least a few times that if someone takes me up on this suggestion then I'll ask that the other ATF mods leave the thread alone. That's just a given, to me. I wouldn't advise someone that this is the right avenue for complaints and then just watch the thread get closed without saying something. However, so far no one has ever followed through, and I'm not about to start doing it for people.

Doesn't this kind of speak to the problem? Mat has indicated that, loosely speaking, he never wants to see anything about Politics in ATF again, and we know from experience he's willing to delete things just because he feels like it. But you're like, "no, no, trust me, ATF is a viable place to air your complaints about this forum, I'll even ask nicely for the mods to not delete it?"

Nah, if you really believe that, how about you show me? That you won't "start doing it for people" speaks volumes here. I'm supposed to go write a thoughtful summary of you enabling racists to post in ATF and have Mat snap-delete it so you can say "welp, I tried"?

I'll take your "take it to ATF" posts seriously when you show that you seriously want people to be able to discuss those complaints there.

To be clear, your opinion is unimportant to me and I don't really care whether you take me seriously or not. I'm not interested in discussing the moderation with you further in this forum. What you do beyond that is up to you.

I don't doubt it, but what you're saying to me right now is the exact same thing you say to anyone who complains about your moderation. It's good to get confirmation that your "take it to ATF, where I will very nicely ask Mat to not delete it and give no ****s when he does anyway" shtick is really just a nice way of telling people who complain that you don't want to hear it.

If we're airing grievances, I'd less fewer racist dipshits, please.

I suppose he could tell you to put it somewhere else

That would be fairer on ATF as well.

Then where is he going to put that giant stick?

Trying to help the 7 year with her homework while she is wanting to listen to Billy Eilish who I don't appreciate and don't want to listen to:
Me: If you're going to listen to her then you'll have to do your homework on your own. It's propaganda and I don't want to hear it.
Her: But you listen to propaganda too like that weird Brazilian lady
Me: That's called whataboutism.

Who gives a rats ass what any of you aholes think anyway?

You should leave a note in any edited post.

Don't you go disparagin' Dragnet in my forum. Also, I totally need a Ben Romero.

+1

I think he usually does, btw.

This is not going to work

From the onset of the new forum I complained about a year ago about Well Named's modding. I no longer have a problem with it. Not because I'm okay with it, but because there's just nothing you can do about it

It is like trying to get ToothSayer banned from BFI. It's just not going to happen. He even left that forum and several posters wanted him to come back. Every forum is modded different with different rules ldo

It just is what it is. The system here is going to auto prompt the very nature the P&S forum has taken on, because the powers that be own the system. Your only choice is to put up with it or not

I'm pretty sure I predicted the way this forum was gonna turn out when it reopened and this is exactly what happened. It's not going to change because the leaders want it that way and unfortunately that is their right no matter how much we know about their pasts

The only other thing I'll say is it looks like there's only one mod based on the lobby showing at the bottom of the screen. Is that the case? I think that is crazy. Too much for one person to handle. There should be more than one imo

And it should be in green

TeflonDawg4Mod!

It would definitely be preferable to have more mods. The couple people who I've had in mind have directly declined. Last month I asked if there were any volunteers. There were none. So, it doesn't seem to be that easy of a problem to solve. I'm sure it's mostly distress at the thought of having to work with me. But, I'm certainly still willing to talk to anyone that thinks they would be willing to give it a shot.


I'm not sure if by "leaders" you just mean me. If so, well, sort of. There are at least some big philosophical points of disagreement where I'm not likely to change my approach. Those disagreements have been hashed out more than a few times with goofy and some others, and I don't think there's any value in rehashing them ad infinitum. So, on those issues, you are right: for me the choice is for them to put up with it or not. At the same time, there are plenty of marginal moderation decisions where I often change my mind when someone reports a post, or PMs me.

If by leaders you mean the site admins, then I think there's a fairly common misconception that the moderation here reflects their desires in some specific way. You can certainly infer a few things from the way the old forum was closed, but this version is basically my Frankenstein's monster, and I think the more accurate statement is that 2+2 is willing to indulge me so long as it doesn't cause them a big headache.

But that's why I send goofy (and a few others) to ATF, or the mod forum, or the site admins. We have disagreements on points where I'm not going to change my mind just to accommodate them, and they are never going to agree with me. So, it makes sense, if they want to escalate, to talk to the management.

The idea that I'm expecting 2+2 admins to just auto-defer to my views is wrong. The old forum got shut down mostly just because of the volume of complaints (and not, in my view, primarily because of the overwhelming validity of those complaints). I'm pretty sure that if there are enough complaints then something will change in this forum also. Probably it would just be closed as well. Honestly, the thing that surprises me the most is that this hasn't already become an issue.

So, I'm not responding to goofy this way because I think I have a get out of jail free card, as it were. I'm responding this way because I think it makes the most sense (and because there are unrelated reasons why I think a moderation thread is problematic in this forum)

You all only want one rationale, and the rest banned. Goofyballer, trolley, and now you apparently, are only tolerable of one type of rationale. This is why the SJW's have such issue with the moderation of this forum.

That's one of the key differences in the two 'sides.'

The talk is always about the left being unrealistic but it's the right who whines and squeals like a child about not getting their way, while people on the soft left/center acquiesce to reality - like Teflon and myself. This has obviously directly impacted the way the media in our country operates.

By "rationale" do you mean ideology? I mean, I think you're pretty stupid and the mental health day you took to recuperate from the Arbery thread was definitely a good idea, but I don't want you banned. What are you talking about?

lol wut, dude is saying he's tolerable.

That's why he's here.

No, I mean rationale. It's not necessarily me I'm referring. Most of the disagreements in this form isn't around conclusions but rather how people think, and arrive at those conclusions. I'm rather certain that if WN was stricter with moderation, the sjws would leverage that, as would some more of hardcore righties, if WN had more sympathy for them.

By the way I wasn't angry at all, I was completely exasperated at that particular exchange.