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04-23-2025 , 06:36 AM

#12751

jalfrezi

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: May 2012 Posts: 20,481

Quote:

Originally Posted by chezlaw

Indeed. Almost as tiny and irrelevent as our vote

I was mistaken to think your anguish and fury for all it's sillyness in manifestation was because you thought it actually mattered. So some progress. That's if I believe you really think it's all irrelevent.

Now you're just being plain dishonest. You know very well I think these things matter and that debating them is important to us and to our understanding, but expecting much real world impact is where the silliyess lies.

Quote

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04-23-2025 , 07:34 AM

#12752

chezlaw

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Jan 2004 Posts: 50,837

You were the one arguing it didn't matter to the real world in any significant way. It's your dishonesty.

I've always thought it mattered.

Quote

04-23-2025 , 07:40 AM

#12753

chezlaw

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Jan 2004 Posts: 50,837

Quote:

Originally Posted by jalfrezi

Others were also pre-emptively banned eg chezlaw and ikestoys. Then ikes joined as CaffeineNeeded and when unmasked claimed he was a changed man, though of course he's still as racist as **** as his Indian neighbours will attest.

Hardly anyone on UP is a lefty - they're brazenly pro capitalism centrists (though that might seem left to you).

Also, there's something very odd going on in your posts which are inserting an Â’ before every single quote. wtf? It even did it to my post when you quoted it.

I was unbanned almost immediately.

No suprise its not left wing at UP. I always found P to be right wing as well.

Quote

04-23-2025 , 07:48 AM

#12754

jalfrezi

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: May 2012 Posts: 20,481

Quote:

Originally Posted by chezlaw

You were the one arguing it didn't matter to the real world in any significant way. It's your dishonesty.

I've always thought it mattered.

I obviously meant it matters wrt people's learning here and how they think about politics. The tiny size of this forum makes it hardly matter at all in the real world. Stop chezzing around.

Quote

04-23-2025 , 07:55 AM

#12755

chezlaw

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Jan 2004 Posts: 50,837

No I won't stop chezzing.

Good to know we both agree that it does matter.

Quote

04-23-2025 , 08:26 AM

#12756

Trolly McTrollson

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Oct 2010 Posts: 39,809

Shut the **** up, chez.

Quote

04-23-2025 , 09:12 AM

#12757

d2_e4

certifiable moron

Join Date: Sep 2014 Posts: 21,696

Quote:

Originally Posted by chezlaw

I was unbanned almost immediately.

No suprise its not left wing at UP. I always found P to be right wing as well.

Lmao at jal saying that. The place is one big ideological purity test. Man, if UP isn't left wing enough for you, you might be a bit of an extremist.

Quote

04-23-2025 , 09:54 AM

#12758

jalfrezi

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: May 2012 Posts: 20,481

It’s an ideological purity test of people’s liberalism, nothing more. Though their definition of liberalism doesn’t extend to listening to non liberals.

Quote

04-23-2025 , 10:04 AM

#12759

chezlaw

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Jan 2004 Posts: 50,837

Quote:

Originally Posted by d2_e4

Lmao at jal saying that. The place is one big ideological purity test. Man, if UP isn't left wing enough for you, you might be a bit of an extremist.

If it's like P then it's good on racism/etc with the purity being on the name calling and refusing any attempt at being reasonable. Hence all the tone policing, secret heart, white knighting, reasonable inference etc etc etc bollocks.

When the meat of politics came up it tended to centre right pretty quickly even though some of the regulars were left wing.

Quote

04-23-2025 , 10:25 AM

#12760

jalfrezi

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: May 2012 Posts: 20,481

No. It’s just a classic Democrat liberali bs site. A lot of them don’t even want government funded UHC,

Quote

04-23-2025 , 10:46 AM

#12761

Rococo

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Jul 2004 Posts: 25,081

Quote:

Originally Posted by chezlaw

No suprise its not left wing at UP. I always found P to be right wing as well.

I apparently am in the minority, but debates about where a politics forum or a specific political opinion falls on a left/right political spectrum are intrinsically uninteresting to me.

The debate should be about what is just, what is beneficial, what is achievable, how to balance the long term versus the short term, etc.

People who focus obsessively on the labels almost always treat left (or right) as self-evidently good, which leads to semantic arguments that effectively amount to "X is left-wing (or right-wing). Q.E.D."

Quote

04-23-2025 , 11:04 AM

#12762

d2_e4

certifiable moron

Join Date: Sep 2014 Posts: 21,696

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rococo

If you watch Fox, everything you don't like in politics is "communist", if you watch MSNBC, it's "fascist", and if you're Luciom, it's "radical leftist".

Quote

04-23-2025 , 11:26 AM

#12763

geezerchess

Pooh-Bah

Join Date: Jan 2025 Posts: 5,097

Quote:

Originally Posted by Trolly McTrollson

Shut the **** up, chez.

I like to hear what Chez has to say.

Quote

04-23-2025 , 11:27 AM

#12764

Trolly McTrollson

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Oct 2010 Posts: 39,809

Quote:

Originally Posted by geezerchess

I like to hear what Chez has to say.

Shut the **** up, bigot.

Quote

04-23-2025 , 11:33 AM

#12765

geezerchess

Pooh-Bah

Join Date: Jan 2025 Posts: 5,097

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rococo

Well said.

I've been saying for some time that the "official" narratives of Left vs. Right, Liberal vs. Conservative, Democrat vs. Republican are not particularly helpful.

I personally believe more useful categorizations are The Elite vs. Ordinary Folks, Monied Interests vs. Average Citizens.

Quote

04-23-2025 , 11:36 AM

#12766

geezerchess

Pooh-Bah

Join Date: Jan 2025 Posts: 5,097

Quote:

Originally Posted by Trolly McTrollson

Shut the **** up, bigot.

Sorry buddy, but I won't fall for your flattery.

Quote

04-23-2025 , 11:44 AM

#12767

Rococo

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Jul 2004 Posts: 25,081

Quote:

Originally Posted by geezerchess

Thanks, but you shouldn't interpret my post as an argument for a populist framing either.

Quote

04-23-2025 , 11:48 AM

#12768

geezerchess

Pooh-Bah

Join Date: Jan 2025 Posts: 5,097

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rococo

Thanks, but you shouldn't interpret my post as an argument for a populist framing either.

I wasn't trying to imply that you were.

I was merely agreeing that the "official narrative" isn't the best.

Quote

04-23-2025 , 12:04 PM

#12769

chezlaw

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Jan 2004 Posts: 50,837

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rococo

I agree. It's just a shorthand for where you tend to be on the answers.

I'd really like more discussion about the very things you say but there's not much interest in talking about politics these days.

I say P was right wing because when we did talk about policies they would often fit happily to the right of moderate conservative circles in th uk.

Quote

04-23-2025 , 12:12 PM

#12770

chezlaw

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Jan 2004 Posts: 50,837

Quote:

Originally Posted by geezerchess

I like to hear what Chez has to say.

Don't worry about Trolly. He's just sad to be losing his no 1 whiners spot. He got complacent.

Quote

04-23-2025 , 12:16 PM

#12771

jalfrezi

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: May 2012 Posts: 20,481

I heard he might be regaining it.

Quote

04-23-2025 , 01:54 PM

#12772

Rococo

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Jul 2004 Posts: 25,081

Quote:

Originally Posted by geezerchess

I wasn't trying to imply that you were.

I was merely agreeing that the "official narrative" isn't the best.

Fair enough.

Quote

04-23-2025 , 05:27 PM

#12773

Luciom

banned

Join Date: Oct 2007 Posts: 20,658

Quote:

Originally Posted by d2_e4

If you watch Fox, everything you don't like in politics is "communist", if you watch MSNBC, it's "fascist", and if you're Luciom, it's "radical leftist".

There are things I hate in politics which aren't radical leftism, it's just that they tend to be weaker forces these days so I focus less on them

But legal bans on sex work, porn, obsessive crusades against gambling, alcohol and so on ("vice laws") are horrific for me and inimical to my core values and I know they typically come from the "social right" more than the radical left (although the radical left can agree with some on those , it depends on local tastes, like here they agree to be against gambling)

Quote

04-23-2025 , 06:06 PM

#12774

formula72

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Mar 2007 Posts: 6,385

Quote:

Originally Posted by jalfrezi

I will say that I am a bit surprised that they have a decent cabal of pro cappers but it definitely depends on the thread. They still have a thread for knob slobbing Xi and the Soviets so it still offers a healthy mix of fun for everyone. But I do like seeing and reading a mix of thought in one place.

Quote:

Originally Posted by chezlaw

I was unbanned almost immediately.

No suprise its not left wing at UP. I always found P to be right wing as well.

Those would be some humorous right wingers. But everything is relative to one's own personal perception of things, I guess.

Last edited by formula72; 04-23-2025 at 06:20 PM.