A lot of these police shootings some see as outright murder I see more as a cop going into panic mode the instant they perceive their life to be in jeopardy and start blazing away. So yeah, we can expect something similar to occur in these situations as well. The question is more the net outcome, which I'm thinking will skew heavily towards the positive.

Yeah it was pretty obvious they were in spin mode right from the start. And I think the only reason we've heard what we've heard so far is because they're trying to get out in front of an even worse picture once all the details come to light.

This kind of insinuation is why you have no credibility and come off as writing in bad faith.

Maybe all the fuss about the cops is a way of distracting from the need to limit access to guns.

Probably mistakes were made. Can't expect a small town police department to have any idea.

Could be but there's a danger of bias because of how horrendous this incident is and it being hard for the police to make it much worse while much less worse seems so plausible

but if the general reaction is to storm in then we will get a wide range of cases including where the suspicious intruder was entirely innocent or an unarmed threat. Then the reaction might be skewed the other way. Especially if einstein is right and these cops are so scared and ill-disciplined.

I dont think it's cynical as much as the usuual problem that people debate about how to manage disasters far more than preventing them.

but yes absolutely. This mass murderer should simply not have had the guns. That is ~100% of the problem.

I am suggesting that the cop's actions were not a "mistake". They knew they should go in but didn't want to risk being shot. Simple as that.

Thank you for sharing.

Occam's razor would suggest that this is the most likely explanation.

https://www.newsnationnow.com/us-new...pect-response/

All the while there were 911 calls coming from inside the classroom.

I am leaning more toward incompetence by whoever was in charge than widespread cowardice among every officer on the scene.

It can be both. The border patrol agent who killed the shooter was getting a haircut when he received a text about the incident from his wife (who worked at the school, and his daughter was at the school so he was highly motivated). He borrowed the barbers shotgun and against the wishes of the CO went in to confront and kill shooter. Anyone of the 19 could have figured out (since there was sporadic shooting while they were waiting) that the time to act was now but easier to just follow orders.

"Coward Police!"

The nation with the second amendment and all the guns and then this? For real?

The police didn't go after the shooter for an hour waiting outside, instead they then went after concerned parents throwing them to the ground and arresting them because they were urging them to go in. What a disgrace? Yeah!

At least as likely that they sufficiently justified a belief that they shoudn't go in because they didn't want to risk getting shot.

Agreed, but the percentage of people who would follow a "stay put" order in that situation is a million times higher than the percentage of people who would refuse a "go in" order.

In a lot of other active shooter situations, cops have acted with much more immediacy. Maybe the cops in Uvalde are uniquely cowardly, but I doubt it. That's why incompetent leadership on the scene seems more likely to me.

As an aside, if you asked me to identify the systemic problems with U.S. policing, an unwillingness to confront and shoot armed assailants would be be very low on the list.

F it!

If I am a parent I'm going in!!

It's Texas right? Everyone has a gun so why didn't one of the parents go in and pull a John mclane? I dobt get it. Police was waiting over an hour outside and argued with the parents.

Bye the way they knew already he shot his grandma in the head. They knew everything. And then they make a picnic outside to the sound of sporadic gunshots for over and hour???

Where was swat team and helicoptors and snipers?
Wtf? Why go to the police if you can't protect from a 18 year old guns slaying idiot?

Well, now you know why there is a prevalence of Americans who feel that the police can't really protect them adequately and choose to do it themselves.

I guess I heard that before yeah. Why didn't they though? Given it's Texas I'm betting at least 50% of the parents outside had a gun or rifle with them. Why not go in and get the guy?

Maybe you missed it, but the police were stopping parents from going in. Lol at 50%.

Yeah i figured. But If im a parent no police can stop me to enter the damn building to rescue my kid. How many you think? More? It's Texas, so I would think they all came by car and if not on them then in their car they had at least a couple rifles and guns on the scene.

I think that is a very complicated question.

I prefer to look at from the point 3. Should the police be able to stop you going in, if they have decided they are not and instead will just set up a parameter and contain strategy?

Think of it like firemen rushing in to a burning building and bringing people out, one by one. You hear the fire chief say, 'That is it, no one else is going in. I think the building is going to collapse'. I think that is fair of him to say and to protect his firemen. But if you are a parent on scene and know your kids are still in there, should they be able to stop you taking that risk?

What if the Chief was wrong and the collapse was not imminent and you had lots of time to get in and out but they stopped you acting? Should you be allowed to risk your life, if you want to?


Some will say the risk of a parent rushing is different, which it is. But every situation is different. A person in the school, who chooses to actively defend themselves has that right but in doing so might put others at risk. Make it harder for the police, if they are coming in or have a sniped in place to take the bad guy out. Other negatives may come from that person acting as opposed to standing down and leaving it in the hands of the cops. But they are allowed to defend themselves regardless.

So my view is that if Police or Fire stand down, due their OWN personal risk, then others should not be blocked from stepping up.

Where I would be more cautious is if police are marshaling to go in and some parent wants to just rush in first. If the police are engaging then I believe they can clear the crime scene of reactive people.

Obligatory...

https://www.theonion.com/no-way-to-p...s-r-1848971668

Archives:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/%22No_...s#Bibliography

American right wants their AR-15s more than they care about mass shootings.


That's the bottom line.

Typical Demoncrat talking point. I'm not even sure that the majority of the "American right" even knows in any detail about what an AR-15 even is*. I'm pretty sure that most Demoncrats falsely believe that "AR" literally means "Assault Rifle."

*Including me.

Addendum: I favour stricter gun laws.