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The costs of trans visibility The costs of trans visibility

03-13-2024 , 01:55 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Luciom
No the reason is freedom lol jfc. Like we allow to buy coke even if it's bad for health.

Then yes condom are also "good" in various context or can be framed as such. But that's not the reason why we "allow" their sale jfc.

The state doesn't "allow", everything is allowed unless specifically prohibited
you’ve spent many many posts literally saying the state shouldn’t allow puberty blockers or books.

In theory the first sentence could be correct. In reality in America and other places peoples private sex lives, what they wear, and birth control methods are all highly contested, and it’s so comically disingenuous to act as though you aren’t one of that kind of activist.
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03-13-2024 , 01:58 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Luciom
Pretty sure the majority of pediatricians worldwide are against giving puberty blockers to 11y old kids diagnosed with gender disphoria. Many of them (not sure if the absolute majority though) would also claim that a 11y old can't be gender disphoric to begin with.
Have I made a medical claim about 11 year olds ITT?
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03-13-2024 , 02:01 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Didace
What if everyone was either above or below the median?
That's crazy talk.
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03-13-2024 , 02:02 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Luciom
Even if this might be semantically true depending on some definitions/assumptions, if it is it is still pretty meaningless because if qualitatively everyone is in a cathegory, then it becomes a matter of quantity and thresholds of that quantity that become problematic enough to warrant a definition.

"everyone has suboptimal health", compared to the max possible perfection imaginable, is very probably true and completly useless as well.
Well I think there are conditions that we would all recognize as mental illness, and then there are conditions that are mental illnesses for political purposes, conditions that haven't yet been recognized as mental illness, and conditions that are currently recognized as mental illness that one day won't be. Not really too much rigor there and lots of abuse possible.
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03-13-2024 , 02:02 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by spaceman Bryce
you’ve spent many many posts literally saying the state shouldn’t allow puberty blockers or books.

In theory the first sentence could be correct. In reality in America and other places peoples private sex lives, what they wear, and birth control methods are all highly contested, and it’s so comically disingenuous to act as though you aren’t one of that kind of activist.
Nope i spent many many posts saying the state shouldn't allow minors diagnosed with gender disphoria to get puberty blockers, and PUBLIC SCHOOLS shouldn't have pornographic books in school libraries.

Both are topic wrt minors which aren't allowed normal freedoms because incapable of fully deciding for themselves.

I never asked to ban books from any facility for adults at all (public or private), nor to block adult people from accessing any treatment they want to modify their body, if they pay for them without asking anything from taxpayers.

I actually wrote anyone (in a sane state of mind, conscious from the pov of the law, who can sign contracts and so on) should be allowed to consume any substance at all no exception. And self modify, or get his body self modified, as much as he wants.

I am an activist to protect minors from violence though, and leftist violence to minors recently is particularly repugnant, while in the past it was the clear opposite for a very long time.

It's about who has cultural power in society i guess, unfortunately that's often used to abuse children systematically. We can hope one day whomever has cultural power stops abusing minors, but that day hasn't come yet.

I had personally hoped that ended with churches losing most of their cultural power, but the new church of the letter soup is taking their place and doing the same to minors so i am here to do my part to reduce the damage the church of letter soup inflicts on kids.

///

It has been several decades since birth control "being contested" in the USA simply meant people refuse to pay for other people birth control, and that's perfectly fine and compatible with freedom.
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03-13-2024 , 02:04 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by uke_master
Have I made a medical claim about 11 year olds ITT?
I might have hallucinated your support for puberty blockers given to gender disphoric children.

If so i am sorry.

So are you , as the majority of worldwide experts are, fully against prescribing puberty blockers to kids who have been diagnosed as gender disphoric? if not, why do you have an opinion on an expert subject which differs from that of the majority of worldwide experts on the topic?
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03-13-2024 , 02:07 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Didace
Are you saying that people with degrees in education make more money when they have jobs in education?
Are you sure you need a "degree in education" to be a public school k12 teacher in the 50 states?
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03-13-2024 , 02:09 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Luciom

It has been several decades since birth control "being contested" in the USA simply meant people refuse to pay for other people birth control, and that's perfectly fine and compatible with freedom.
Nothing in your post disputes what I wrote, it just confirms it. Similarly there are people against giving condoms to minors because they think minors shouldn’t be having sex outside of marriage. The quoted portion is just wrong. Have you seen the news in regards to abortion?
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03-13-2024 , 02:10 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by spaceman Bryce
Nothing in your post disputes what I wrote, it just confirms it. Similarly there are people against giving condoms to minors because they think minors shouldn’t be having sex outside of marriage. The quoted portion is just wrong. Have you seen the news in regards to abortion?
Abortion isn't birth control omg.

Yes there can be people against birth control for minors.
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03-13-2024 , 02:19 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by browser2920
The difference is one of those is considered a slur. Please stop using it.

From our guidelines:
So does that apply to grannies as well? OK I will not use it . Just delete the word and let me know
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03-13-2024 , 02:23 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Luciom
Abortion isn't birth control omg.

Yes there can be people against birth control for minors.
I agree those are not the same thing. But I was referring to the debate in regards to abortion.
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03-13-2024 , 02:27 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Luciom
Abortion isn't birth control omg.

Yes there can be people against birth control for minors.
You might not think so but some women think of it that way
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03-13-2024 , 02:30 PM
https://www.vox.com/24087411/anti-ab...traception-ivf

relevant article in terms of the point I was making.
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03-13-2024 , 02:34 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by lozen
You might not think so but some women think of it that way
maybe some very radical leftist women do, but lol no that's not the normal way to think of abortion even for people pro abortion.

Birth control are the ways to avoid getting pregnant. That's also the medical definition.
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03-13-2024 , 02:40 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Luciom
maybe some very radical leftist women do, but lol no that's not the normal way to think of abortion even for people pro abortion.

Birth control are the ways to avoid getting pregnant. That's also the medical definition.
from the article

Quote:
In rationalizing the idea that birth control can somehow abort a pregnancy before a pregnancy begins, activists make a number of claims. Human Life International, a global Catholic group, maintains that anything that prevents implantation is an abortion-inducing agent. IUDs, they insist, cause “early abortions.” Students for Life of America likewise claims all forms of hormonal birth control, including IUDs and the Pill, are abortifacients.

Georgia Republican Rep. Marjorie Taylor Greene went so far as to proclaim that Plan B emergency contraception “kills a baby in the womb once a woman is already pregnant” even though studies have shown the drug interferes with ovulation but does not inhibit implantation.

Greene isn’t the only Republican lawmaker blurring the lines. Colorado Rep. Lauren Boebert tried to block funds for “abortifacient contraceptive drugs,” while Montana Rep. Matt Rosendale tried adding emergency contraception to a bill barring use of the federal funding for abortion. In 2022, in perhaps one of the most glaring examples, Missouri Republicans pushed unsuccessfully to restrict public funding for IUDs and emergency contraception, with one of the state senators who led it proclaiming that “life begins at conception,” and “anything that destroys that life is abortion, it’s not birth control.”
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03-13-2024 , 03:11 PM
Summary of Luciom's political theories:

1. Policies I agree with = state should be a neutral arbiter and enforce property rights.

2. Policies I disagree with: the right wing politicians should ban it all, jail those who think differently and kill all politicians dissenters.

Don't expect any other consistencies.
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03-13-2024 , 04:26 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by jjjou812
Summary of Luciom's political theories:

1. Policies I agree with = state should be a neutral arbiter and enforce property rights.

2. Policies I disagree with: the right wing politicians should ban it all, jail those who think differently and kill all politicians dissenters.

Don't expect any other consistencies.
I disagree with a lot of stuff that I wouldn't apply 2) to.

Like public schools. Democracy should decide even if i would prefer fully private charter schools with no public option.

Same for a lot of other stuff.

But I understand I am far enough from your preferences that, like every single leftwing person alive does everytime he meets someone who has very different values, you need to demonize me
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03-13-2024 , 04:28 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by spaceman Bryce
from the article
You got it opposite.

These are freaks who consider birth control a kind of abortion.

I was discussing the fact that abortion isn't birth control.
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03-13-2024 , 04:48 PM
I mean, of course abortion is birth control. Literally. Abortion is an act of controlling a birth; a woman decides she shouldn't bring forth a child and controls its birth to the point of ending it before it happens.

"Fully private charter schools with no public option" -- so, what happens to all the children of parents who can't afford private (inevitably for-profit) education? I mean, I know libertarians loathe and fear the poor, but damn!

Last edited by Karl_TheOG_Marx; 03-13-2024 at 04:51 PM. Reason: if you don't have control of something, how could you end it?
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03-13-2024 , 04:49 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Luciom

But I understand I am far enough from your preferences that, like every single leftwing person alive does everytime he meets someone who has very different values, you need to demonize me
Nobody needs to demonize you. You do a perfectly good job of doing that all by yourself. You are a demon.

Last edited by Karl_TheOG_Marx; 03-13-2024 at 04:52 PM. Reason: or, one might say, a ghoul
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03-13-2024 , 04:51 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Karl_TheOG_Marx
Nobody needs to demonize you. You do a perfectly good job of doing that all by yourself. You are a demon.
Charter schools are the great satan
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03-13-2024 , 04:52 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Karl_TheOG_Marx
I mean, of course abortion is birth control. Literally. Abortion is an act of controlling a birth; a woman decides she shouldn't bring forth a child and controls its birth to the point of ending it before it happens.

"Fully private charter schools with no public option" -- so, what happens to all the children of parents who can't afford private (inevitably for-profit) education? I mean, I know libertarians loathe and fear the poor, but damn!
They go to charter schools with government vouchers.

Where education is better for less money than public schools (not hard to do a better job that those cesspits).

I am not against public funding of basic education, I am not an anarchist, nor an anarchocapitalist.
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03-13-2024 , 05:02 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Luciom
They go to charter schools with government vouchers.

Where education is better for less money than public schools (not hard to do a better job that those cesspits).

I am not against public funding of basic education, I am not an anarchist, nor an anarchocapitalist.
There are approximately ten billion reasons why forcing all children into charter schools is an awful idea (not to mention the dissonance between "fully private" and "government vouchers"), but whatever, I'm just glad to learn you're not an AnCap, that's a rather pernicious form of cruel idiocy.

There's no point in this continuing this further ITT; obviously we've strayed far from the topic of "trans visibility", on which you are equally transphobic as your more strident libertarian friends.
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03-13-2024 , 05:18 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Karl_TheOG_Marx
There are approximately ten billion reasons why forcing all children into charter schools is an awful idea (not to mention the dissonance between "fully private" and "government vouchers"), but whatever, I'm just glad to learn you're not an AnCap, that's a rather pernicious form of cruel idiocy.

There's no point in this continuing this further ITT; obviously we've strayed far from the topic of "trans visibility", on which you are equally transphobic as your more strident libertarian friends.
forcing children in charter schools (giving them an option) is worse than forcing children in the public school of their neighborhood, which surely helps people in a ghetto
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03-13-2024 , 05:19 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Luciom
I disagree with a lot of stuff that I wouldn't apply 2) to.

Like public schools. Democracy should decide even if i would prefer fully private charter schools with no public option.

Same for a lot of other stuff.

But I understand I am far enough from your preferences that, like every single leftwing person alive does everytime he meets someone who has very different values, you need to demonize me
Says the guy who is decrying the evils of the left wing/Marxist/liberal/democratic agenda across every thread this week.
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