It seems like an unusually high % of these posters play on UB/AP. Its really weird.

On the plus side it's a good deal more comprehensible than most of his posts.

Ah, yes, to boldly go to biasly defend.

Such is the life of a professional shill in Starfleet.

'lo, snake.

Yes, but he ran lie a god for the first 40 hands!

40 "games" shilltard. You know you might be the worst shill volunteer on the planet. I would pay money for a glimpse into how jacked up your life is. Can you do like a 1 day live stream while you're posting all day. You gotta be either 27 or 35. White. Sexually frustrated. Micro Stakes sng grinder. You drive a 94-96ish honda civic maybe accord. You rent. You have a receding hairline that makes you super insecure. You're pasty. You still wear khakis and you have a fish.

Gotta be close.

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Pot..., meet kettle. Seriously dude, were you looking around the room when you wrote that?
Don't suppose it matters but a superuser is someone who can see the hole cards, making it even less likely that they would call AK with 10 4. I suspect the trouble you are having with the game is the fact you think someone who folds 3 hands in a row is a solid tag.

And here's a photo I took of Snake:

15,531st

It's really remarkable how often various riggies claim something... and then, as evidence, they provide something that totally undermines their argument.

It's like being told that the sky is red, and then, as evidence of this, being provided a photo of a clear blue sky. It's totally bizarre.

EG:

-The superuser who puts his money all-in behind

-The action hands that exist to increase site rake

-The pseudo-random shuffle that is claimed to PokerStars, as proven by the PokerStars website that says it is not pseudo-random


I wonder if this is a medical phenomenon (ie, the brains of these people are fundamentally different to everyone else's) or whether it is just some bizarre alternative reality that these people construct for themselves in their own little world. Perhaps they can't understand why they are losing, and thus, these self-evidently flawed ideas get jumbled together to form some sort of disjointed narrative that only makes sense in their own distorted world.

I wonder if this symptom is connected to the same malfunctioning part of their brain that exclaims "This is rigged! I can't win!" while simultaneously loading another set of tournaments. I assume those people who claim it is rigged and keep playing know deep down that the games are legitimate.

So I typed hands when I meant games. Shoot me.

Average posts < 4 per day.

Really? Not 29 or 31? How do you come up with this stuff?

Sorry, snake, out by a mile.

Um...

I won't get my hopes up. When you come back, could you please stop with the random capitalization of words?

QFT.

BugandoNSX
banned

The latter.
This phenomenon is by no means confined to poker players or even gamblers.

Throughout history there have been scientists and others who have devised a theory and become so obsessed by it that every time a hole is pointed out they construct ever more baroque caveats, codicils and additions until they and their theory become a standing joke.

Possibly but they are almost certainly what we would consider 'degenerate gamblers' so that particular logic circuit might be completely miswired.

It's to the point where not only should he be immediately banned but all posts deleted. Why even allow this idiot to say anything that remains on the board at this point.

I for one am very concerned that if too many people continue to see his arguments against me, my shilling will be exposed and we can't have that.

QFT, +1, me too, etc.

I know there are some who think the insults directed at the 'tards should not be happening but the other side of the coin is that we have to put up with a small number of posters who keep repeating the same old nonsense over and over again and simply ignoring any posts that answer their concerns (or, worse, accusing someone who has spent some time carefully and politely answering their question of being a shill).

This has the undesirable effect of causing genuine posters with genuine concerns to be treated in a much more offhand manner than they really deserve and may stop some from ever asking a pertinent question in case they get flamed.

I've never been a fan of normal site members asking for people to be banned but I wonder if it might be time to be a little harsher to those who are intent on continually asking the same questions and ignoring the answers and libeling other members and the poker sites.

As a quid pro quo I'm sure this would lead to a politer and more constructive approach by the 'debunkers' to those with genuine concerns who are sufficiently open minded to actually think about the answers they get.

Actually, this is not as confusing as it seems as it all stems back to why they have their beliefs. Riggies are basically "conspiracy light" guys, and conspiracy guys are generally driven by their need to believe there is some hidden truth that they can help discover.

The rush comes from the process, not from actually obtaining any conclusion, as any conclusion (whether it be for or against them) will end the process. The worst thing that could ever happen to 9/11 guys is if Bush came out and said "Nah Nah Nah Nah Nah Nah - I did it pppppfffftttt" because after the short term cheers of saying "We were right!" the next thing they would say would be "umm, now what do we do?"

Then they would create a new conspiracy.

Riggies basically work the same way and if you watch carefully the debates between the likely genuine riggies (few lately) and the "shills" you will see that it is all about the debate to the riggies. Hit them with waves of logic, and they will hit back with new layers to their theories.

That is why if we listed all the genuine riggie theories we would see hundreds of different ones that often times directly conflict with each other.

This thread and the "shills" represent the "authority" to them because the rooms themselves pretty much politely ignore them as they should, so this gives them the platform to continue their fight for what is right.

They will point to a blue sky and say it is red and believe it is red because whether it is red or not is secondary, which seems strange, but once you delve into the mind of the riggie it does make sense from their perspective.

LoL why do you guys care so much? Nfuego QPW and Mont.?

The ideal of an Internet forum is a place where people can come and discuss matters and where people can ask for and receive help.

It would be nice if we could be in a position to offer that help without a small element of particularly stupid rigtards clogging things up by repeatedly asking the same old questions and libeling other site members and various organisations.

If we could rid this thread of the very few people who, in reality, do nothing more than troll, it might make it more useful for people who genuinely want to understand.

Just a thought.

I can't speak for the other two, but you are generalizing how you evaluate the debate. I enjoy debunking conspiracy guys (genuine ones, not the recent crop of fake riggies), and this thread gives a calmer version of that situation, compared to for instance a religion or 9/11 thread.

I also have a considerable background in finance and operating businesses, so it is fun bringing that experience into the debate by explaining the common sense approaches any business would take.

You and others sometimes see "patterns" in behavior that simply do not exist. When I say it makes no sense for a business to commit a crime in the way a riggie suggests, it is usually because the riggie crime is just a really dumb choice of doing crime. I am not "defending" the site, the site has nothing to do with the issue. I am addressing the flaws in the point being made to me, by saying that if a site was committing a crime, they would do it in a much better way (which is almost "WELL DUH" in terms of common sense). Doomswitches and action flops are bad, stupid crime.

I also understand why riggies and other oddly paranoid people like yourself (with all your "secrets") need me and others to be shills that "defend the sites" even when that has nothing to do with anything, and as you notice I pretty much let all the shill talk go without much comment other than pointing out that I understand why I need to be a "shill" in your eyes.

That's cool, that's part of the debate process with conspiracy guys.

All the best.

Snake isn't a riggie. And even if he is, people don't, and shouldn't, get banned for having whacky opinions. Or for being idiots. And if they just get off on being rude they can go to BBV. But if their only purpose is to troll other threads for the sake of it, just to get off on insulting people over and over, that's different. I don't speak for any mods, but posting like that just prevents anyone else from having a real discussion and just takes up space, and is nothing more than a huge disruption. I haven't read the forum rules but I'm sure there's one addressing that, and there should be. I hope he gets the message or finds another outlet for his anger (or whatever it is that motivates him) instead of continuing to come back.

I care because the forum has rules, rules that aren't terribly difficult to follow. If a guy slanders people enough without anything to back it up, they get banned. What's the point of a ban if the moron can just come back and post the same crap on a different name?

There isn't a clearer case of somebody who has put in a lot of hard work on his own time to help uncover fraud in the poker world than Josem's. And yet of all people, that's the guy being slandered, accused of making statements he didn't make, and even being compared to Saddam? Sorry, but even in jest, enough is enough.

Every regular contributor to this thread has engaged in plenty of serious discussion. I'm happy to help somebody who legitimately comes in with concerns presented respectfully and share my knowledge/viewpoint.

When some idiot like Sn8ke shows up it undermines the people who really do genuinely have concerns that merit discussion.

http://www.politicsofpoker.com/mlt.html

The problem is bigger then you guys thought...

There's a thread for that already:
http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/57...r-site-721152/

Probably be best to discuss it there.

I don't have "Secrets." It's called privacy. Somethings I want left private so I'm not linked to my personal life. You're still in touch with reality right? I mean outside of the internet? There is no doubt in my mind you're a shill. There's only one other possible explanation. I'll leave it there b/c unlike you I feel bad when I personally attack people and think for a minute it might hurt their moral or effect their personal life outside of this thread.

The problem is the way you go about it. Prime example:
It gets personal with you guys. When I talk about time travel it's a debate, have fun, people say dumb things, nobody gets mad.
But you say online poker is corrupted, the crusade and stoning begins.

Now don't get me wrong I totally agree snake should be banned for violating the 2+2 TOS and our trust.

BTW somebody as passionate as me, notice I don't post on any other sites or any other forums.

I dunno they're saying online poker is rigged. Seems appropriate...

Secrets, Secrets are no fun, unless you tell everyone...