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View Poll Results: Is Online Poker Rigged?
Yes 3,444 34.94%
No 5,522 56.02%
Undecided 892 9.05%
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Old 04-28-2009, 02:11 PM   #2901
KingOfFelt
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Re: The great "Poker is rigged debate" - Collected threads edition

Quote:
Originally Posted by tk1133 View Post
Funny to see the same 5 people here again as usual....
I count 7 "non-rigtards" on this page alone. How about you start with the counting and then get back to us about probability theory.
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Old 04-28-2009, 02:13 PM   #2902
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Re: The great "Poker is rigged debate" - Collected threads edition

MTTs on Jokerstars today. Played 14 cashed in 2.

Lets have a look at the funny hands that KO d me today.

In with best hand; (my hand will be the left one)

AK vs A10........ A 8 7 J All In......River 10.

AQ vs 67 off AIPF ........ 2 6 9 9 2.

KK vs Js6s AIPF.......... 6 As 9 9s 7s.

AQ vs AK .......... Q 10 9 All in 3........River J.

AQ vs 99 ............. Q 5 4 All In.....9 J

KK vs AJ AIPF ......... 8 6 J 7.........A.

AdQd vs A J (my favourite)......... A 8d 3d All in........Js 8

A J vs K Q AIPF......... J 10 K 3 9

A K vs J 10 AIPF.......... 10 9 Q Q 2

In with worst hand;

JJ vs QQ .......... Q 5 6 J All in 5. Set over set bs.

K 10 vs AA.......... K 5 8 All in Q 7.Standard I was short.

J 10 vs A 8............ 9 7 3 All in 9 4.Amazing Call.

5h2h vs 9h 7h .......... 6h Ah Qh 8s Alll in K. Flush vs Flush total bs.

A Q vs 8 2........... Q 8 2 All in K 6.Why has he called raise with 8 2off???

Some more notable Jokerstars hands;

10 9 vs Q 5........... K 10 5 All in..........5 LOL fu jokerstars 3

K Q vs 8 7 ............. K 8 9 All in A..........8 LOL.

How can this bs site not be rigged. I would make money every day in low level MTTs if I didnt get KO d by this constant bs.

hey shills if you wana give % for the hands do it when the money goes in.
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Old 04-28-2009, 02:18 PM   #2903
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Re: The great "Poker is rigged debate" - Collected threads edition

Quote:
Originally Posted by tk1133 View Post
Funny to see the same 5 people here again as usual....
It's getting a bit harder now, isn't it?

You used to be able to try and pretend that it was just me or just Mark but now that there is a veritable army of posters refuting your idiotic suggestions you're having to say '5 people' (even if it is quite a few more).
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Old 04-28-2009, 02:18 PM   #2904
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Re: The great "Poker is rigged debate" - Collected threads edition

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Originally Posted by SooperFish24 View Post
MTTs on Jokerstars today. Played 14 cashed in 2.
lol sample size
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Old 04-28-2009, 02:19 PM   #2905
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Re: The great "Poker is rigged debate" - Collected threads edition

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Originally Posted by tk1133 View Post
For somebody to claim something is legit then put it on the market is one thing, but to prove something is legit then put it on the market is another thing. Like that stock brocker that was ripping everybody off, showing people that this person made this much money and that person made that much money. So it's real! Just ask XXXX. Why should somebody buy that stock if they can't prove it's legit? Do owners say to their clients, "Prove it's not legit, the burden of prove is on the accuser!" No, they don't, ever. That's not how business works. Especially a business that draws this much speculation. Unless they have something to hide. These sites hit the market with no real, authentic proof that it's legit. They create or employ an auditing company that says they reviewed their operations and everything is legit and on the up and up? That's gospel? We and they(haha) saw what happens to CEO's and poker sites that cheat players(UB and AP.) Absolutely nothing. Worst case scenario, you get caught and have to reimburse half the money they stole....I'm at a loss for words here...
I hear ya man! +1
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Old 04-28-2009, 02:20 PM   #2906
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Re: The great "Poker is rigged debate" - Collected threads edition

Quote:
Originally Posted by SooperFish24 View Post
MTTs on Jokerstars today. Played 14 cashed in 2.

Lets have a look at the funny hands that KO d me today.

In with best hand; (my hand will be the left one)

AK vs A10........ A 8 7 J All In......River 10.

AQ vs 67 off AIPF ........ 2 6 9 9 2.

KK vs Js6s AIPF.......... 6 As 9 9s 7s.

AQ vs AK .......... Q 10 9 All in 3........River J.

AQ vs 99 ............. Q 5 4 All In.....9 J

KK vs AJ AIPF ......... 8 6 J 7.........A.

AdQd vs A J (my favourite)......... A 8d 3d All in........Js 8

A J vs K Q AIPF......... J 10 K 3 9

A K vs J 10 AIPF.......... 10 9 Q Q 2

In with worst hand;

JJ vs QQ .......... Q 5 6 J All in 5. Set over set bs.

K 10 vs AA.......... K 5 8 All in Q 7.Standard I was short.

J 10 vs A 8............ 9 7 3 All in 9 4.Amazing Call.

5h2h vs 9h 7h .......... 6h Ah Qh 8s Alll in K. Flush vs Flush total bs.

A Q vs 8 2........... Q 8 2 All in K 6.Why has he called raise with 8 2off???

Some more notable Jokerstars hands;

10 9 vs Q 5........... K 10 5 All in..........5 LOL fu jokerstars 3

K Q vs 8 7 ............. K 8 9 All in A..........8 LOL.

How can this bs site not be rigged. I would make money every day in low level MTTs if I didnt get KO d by this constant bs.

hey shills if you wana give % for the hands do it when the money goes in.
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Old 04-28-2009, 02:21 PM   #2907
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Re: The great "Poker is rigged debate" - Collected threads edition

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Originally Posted by SooperFish24 View Post
MTTs on Jokerstars today. Played 14 cashed in 2..
Yet more perfectly normal hands posted by a player too stupid to even realise it's his own bad play that loses him money.

And just to cement our opinions of hit cretinousness he continues to play on a site he believes is rigged againts him to the point that he can't make money.

How moronic is that?

Hey, supperdish, you do realise that even people who play very good poker can still play a hand perfectly and lose?
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Old 04-28-2009, 02:21 PM   #2908
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Re: The great "Poker is rigged debate" - Collected threads edition

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Originally Posted by dbcooper279 View Post
lol sample size
Yes but its always a small sample. Do you want me to play 1000 MTTs in one day or something.

Small samples can show things too you know.
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Old 04-28-2009, 02:24 PM   #2909
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Re: The great "Poker is rigged debate" - Collected threads edition

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Originally Posted by K13 View Post
From all my history, all I see is I'm losing more than I should when I'm ahead and winning more than I should when I'm behind.

Flush draws are just a joke on PS. But then I again I can't remember the last time I folded one.
Here is a quick statistics lesson that may be helpful. The chart below shows the distribution of how many flush draws you can expect to complete for every 1000 times you flop a flush draw and go to the showdown. As I'm sure you know, the mean value is to complete it 35% of the time. What you probably don't realize, is that most people will not hit the mean value in a sample as small as 1000. The range of normal expectation is quite large.

If you see the showdown with a flopped flush draw as much as 1% of the hands you play (generous) then after 100,000 hands played you might have a sample of 1000. Plug in whatever numbers are realistic for you, but it takes a lot more hands before you have a good chance of being near the mean value.



This covers over 98% of the distribution, I just left off the tails. So for your 1000 flush draws, you will fall in this chart 98% of the time, but nearly 2% of the time your results could be even worse. Notice that the range goes from about 31% flushes to about 39% flushes. And that's if your sample is 1000 showdowns with flush draws.

Now let's look at one that is shows why people often think they are getting screwed because they are looking at even smaller samples. This one shows the distribution if your sample size is only 25 flush draws to the showdown. This time I'm showing 99.95% of the distribution, i.e. virtually all possible outcomes.



Notice the range goes from only 2 flushes to 17 flushes 99% of the time. You could fall anywhere in there and be statistically normal. That's right, if your sample of 25 flush draws sometimes only completes twice, that is normal. Read that statement again.

Notice that you will get 6 or fewer flushes nearly 20% of the time (add the bars). That's normal. You can't expect to get 35% flushes with this small of a sample. That's the logical error that is made all the time.

Now please show your results that fall outside of these normal ranges.
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Old 04-28-2009, 02:24 PM   #2910
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Re: The great "Poker is rigged debate" - Collected threads edition

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Originally Posted by SooperFish24 View Post
Yes but its always a small sample. Do you want me to play 1000 MTTs in one day or something.

Small samples can show things too you know.
HINT: Hand histories are available for more then 24 hours.
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Old 04-28-2009, 02:25 PM   #2911
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Re: The great "Poker is rigged debate" - Collected threads edition

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Originally Posted by qpw View Post
Yet more perfectly normal hands posted by a player too stupid to even realise it's his own bad play that loses him money.

And just to cement our opinions of hit cretinousness he continues to play on a site he believes is rigged againts him to the point that he can't make money.

How moronic is that?

Hey, supperdish, you do realise that even people who play very good poker can still play a hand perfectly and lose?
Noooooo say it aint so. They really can lose after playing a hand perfectly. I find that hard to believe.

Where is the bad play in those hands? For someone who probably doesnt even play poker I find that amusing.

Which hands are played badly qpw? Do you do coaching btw shill?

Im continuing to play there to show how rigged it is with my last few $.
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Old 04-28-2009, 02:26 PM   #2912
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Re: The great "Poker is rigged debate" - Collected threads edition

MTTs on Jokerstars today. Played 14 cashed in 2.

Lets have a look at the funny hands that KO d me today.

In with best hand; (my hand will be the left one)

AK vs A10........ A 8 7 J All In......River 10.

AQ vs 67 off AIPF ........ 2 6 9 9 2.

KK vs Js6s AIPF.......... 6 As 9 9s 7s.

AQ vs AK .......... Q 10 9 All in 3........River J.

AQ vs 99 ............. Q 5 4 All In.....9 J

KK vs AJ AIPF ......... 8 6 J 7.........A.

AdQd vs A J (my favourite)......... A 8d 3d All in........Js 8

A J vs K Q AIPF......... J 10 K 3 9

A K vs J 10 AIPF.......... 10 9 Q Q 2

In with worst hand;

JJ vs QQ .......... Q 5 6 J All in 5. Set over set bs.

K 10 vs AA.......... K 5 8 All in Q 7.Standard I was short.

J 10 vs A 8............ 9 7 3 All in 9 4.Amazing Call.

5h2h vs 9h 7h .......... 6h Ah Qh 8s Alll in K. Flush vs Flush total bs.

A Q vs 8 2........... Q 8 2 All in K 6.Why has he called raise with 8 2off???

Some more notable Jokerstars hands;

10 9 vs Q 5........... K 10 5 All in..........5 LOL fu jokerstars 3

K Q vs 8 7 ............. K 8 9 All in A..........8 LOL.

How can this bs site not be rigged. I would make money every day in low level MTTs if I didnt get KO d by this constant bs.

hey shills if you wana give % for the hands do it when the money goes in.
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Old 04-28-2009, 02:28 PM   #2913
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Re: The great "Poker is rigged debate" - Collected threads edition

Some days I suspect some sort of programming in place that hands out good hands, bad beats, etc, just to sweeten the pot (and, hence, the rake), but then I go on youtube and see similar nutty hands in live poker and realize that it's hands like these that make the game interesting.

IMHO, Online Poker is NOT rigged.
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Old 04-28-2009, 02:29 PM   #2914
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Re: The great "Poker is rigged debate" - Collected threads edition

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Originally Posted by SooperFish24 View Post
Im continuing to play there to show how rigged it is with my last few $.
ROFLMAO

So with your last few $ you're expecting to suddenly come up with some magic HH's that are going to convince all the non rigtards that you were right all along?

In your dreams, drongo, in your dreams.
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Old 04-28-2009, 02:29 PM   #2915
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Re: The great "Poker is rigged debate" - Collected threads edition

Why are you spamming Sooper?
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Old 04-28-2009, 02:30 PM   #2916
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Re: The great "Poker is rigged debate" - Collected threads edition

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Like that stock brocker that was ripping everybody off, showing people that this person made this much money and that person made that much money. So it's real! Just ask XXXX. Why should somebody buy that stock if they can't prove it's legit?
audits have been done of several sites and no proof of malfeasance has been proven. if that doesn't satisfy you, just don't deposit on them.

kind of like if you aren't convinced a stock is legit, just don't buy it.

Patrick Henry didn't say "Give me non-rigged online poker or give me death."

It doesn't say on any country's currency "In Online Poker We Trust."

No one is forcing you to support the industry in any way.

If you've made your decision that it's not fair, don't play. But really, you're kind of a dick making it a personal crusade to prevent others from exercising their freedom to make that choice for themselves.

What's your motivation? What do you hope to come out of this? Regulation of Online Poker? Guess what - the SEC has failed to prevent many stock scandals, including the Madoff fiasco you referenced. So even if it becomes regulated, there might be some laws broken.

Are you against people being allowed to play poker if they choose?

Are you against gambling?

Do you represent financial interests in the gambling business or maybe moral interests in the religion racket?

Or are you just mad that you haven't had the same success you feel entitled to?

Even people who have made it their life's work to stamp out tobacco use have data and statistics to show it's unhealthy. Why not take a page from their book and do the same?

Personally, I don't really believe you're a spokesperson for any organization. I know you'll understand this isn't an insult when I say you aren't the best at communicating to the masses. So really, what are you doing? You say something about "it's funny to see the same 5 posters" or whatever, but you keep saying the same stuff and when we ask you to get to the next level and offer something to convince us it never appears.

By the way, Madden Football is rigged, you are obviously a shill for the video game industry. No way anyone is as good as you without software manipulation.
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Old 04-28-2009, 02:31 PM   #2917
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Re: The great "Poker is rigged debate" - Collected threads edition

Its amazing how fast the shills respond in this thread.

Almost like they re on duty just sitting watching the thread for harmful comments about OP so they can swoop in to the rescue.

What do you guys do for a living btw?
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Old 04-28-2009, 02:35 PM   #2918
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Re: The great "Poker is rigged debate" - Collected threads edition

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Originally Posted by SooperFish24 View Post
MTTs on Jokerstars today. Played 14 cashed in 2.
what is wrong with you? you know you can just cash out and spend your money playing live where your superior skill edge is never manipulated, right?
Quote:
How can this bs site not be rigged. I would make money every day in low level MTTs if I didnt get KO d by this constant bs.
That sounds familiar, did you say that on TV once?
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Old 04-28-2009, 02:36 PM   #2919
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Re: The great "Poker is rigged debate" - Collected threads edition

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Originally Posted by SooperFish24 View Post
Its amazing how fast the rigtards respond in this thread.

Almost like they re on duty just sitting watching the thread for sensible comments about OP so they can swoop in to talk more crap.
FYP
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Old 04-28-2009, 02:37 PM   #2920
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Re: The great "Poker is rigged debate" - Collected threads edition

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what is wrong with you? you know you can just cash out and spend your money playing live where your superior skill edge is never manipulated, right?

That sounds familiar, did you say that on TV once?
No point cashing out 100$ or so thats left.

No I never said that on TV.
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Old 04-28-2009, 02:39 PM   #2921
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Re: The great "Poker is rigged debate" - Collected threads edition

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Almost like they re on duty just sitting watching the thread for harmful comments about OP so they can swoop in to the rescue.

What do you guys do for a living btw?
are you aware of the option to "subscribe" to threads on 2+2?

I play poker on my computer for most of my money. Funny enough, when I have my computer on to play poker, I have the internets open as well, which affords me to the opportunity to respond often. I also type pretty quickly, so maybe that would disprove your latest conspiracy theory.
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Old 04-28-2009, 02:43 PM   #2922
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Re: The great "Poker is rigged debate" - Collected threads edition

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are you aware of the option to "subscribe" to threads on 2+2?

I play poker on my computer for most of my money. Funny enough, when I have my computer on to play poker, I have the internets open as well, which affords me to the opportunity to respond often. I also type pretty quickly, so maybe that would disprove your latest conspiracy theory.
I know you play Mark but last time I asked qpw he declined to answer. I suspect he s never played an OP hand in his life.

And no I wasnt aware of the subscribe option.
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Old 04-28-2009, 02:44 PM   #2923
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Re: The great "Poker is rigged debate" - Collected threads edition

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No point cashing out 100$ or so thats left.
you've said some dumb stuff before, but saying there's no point cashing out $100 is probably the dumbest. you'd rather give it to fish and shills than buy food for your family? whaaaatttt? that sounds like something dangeraw would say.
Quote:
No I never said that on TV.
do you understand what I'm referencing at all?
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Old 04-28-2009, 02:46 PM   #2924
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you've said some dumb stuff before, but saying there's no point cashing out $100 is probably the dumbest. you'd rather give it to fish and shills than buy food for your family? whaaaatttt? that sounds like something dangeraw would say.

do you understand what I'm referencing at all?
No I dont understand.

Im hoping to turn my 100$ into like $1,000,000 just as soon as I hit my boomswitch. Then Ill cash out.
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Old 04-28-2009, 02:47 PM   #2925
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Re: The great "Poker is rigged debate" - Collected threads edition

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And no I wasnt aware of the subscribe option.
you can set it as a default option where you are automatically subscribed to any thread you post in (I think it's under My 2+2/Edit Options) OR you can go to the top of the page where it says "Thread Tools" and manually subscribe that way.

And your statement about being KO'd by BS hands is like Helmuth saying "If it wasn't for luck, I'd win 'em all."
Quote:
Im hoping to turn my 100$ into like $1,000,000 just as soon as I hit my boomswitch. Then Ill cash out.
you'll never get it turned on calling it Jokerstars.
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