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The great "Poker is rigged" debate - Collected threads edition The great "Poker is rigged" debate - Collected threads edition
View Poll Results: Is Online Poker Rigged?
Yes
3,522 34.91%
No
5,626 55.76%
Undecided
941 9.33%

12-10-2010 , 12:57 PM
I like ken******...he makes this thread entertaining, but I feel like he may have run his course
The great "Poker is rigged" debate - Collected threads edition Quote
12-10-2010 , 01:38 PM
The problem is that there's only so far you can go if you are playing the complete ******.

Better to create a persona with just a hint of residual intelligence.
The great "Poker is rigged" debate - Collected threads edition Quote
12-10-2010 , 04:11 PM
I'd be interested to see one of these backwards logic riggies who is coherent, reasonable and witty.
The great "Poker is rigged" debate - Collected threads edition Quote
12-10-2010 , 04:39 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by TBobLP
I'd be interested to see one of these forward thinking riggies who is coherent, reasonable and witty.
hello you called what may i do for you today.
The great "Poker is rigged" debate - Collected threads edition Quote
12-10-2010 , 04:57 PM
Retire this gimmick, create a new one in a few days with a slight alteration, and then watch as many of the shills react exactly the same as if this one had never existed. This one is pretty much dead after a short but mildly amusing run.

Keep track of how your different gimmicks do in terms of longevity and which shill reacted the most then in a while post a summary of the results. You can store the results in SM (Shill Manager).

Good luck on that adventure.
The great "Poker is rigged" debate - Collected threads edition Quote
12-10-2010 , 07:19 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by ken******
hello you called what may i do for you today.
this is like when someone tells a good joke and then somebody else tries to add on a little quip to the punchline or something and just kills it completely
The great "Poker is rigged" debate - Collected threads edition Quote
12-11-2010 , 12:42 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Monteroy
Retire this gimmick, create a new one in a few days with a slight alteration, and then watch as many of the shills react exactly the same as if this one had never existed. This one is pretty much dead after a short but mildly amusing run.

Keep track of how your different gimmicks do in terms of longevity and which shill reacted the most then in a while post a summary of the results. You can store the results in SM (Shill Manager).

Good luck on that adventure.

Shill Manager v2.2 is out

The great "Poker is rigged" debate - Collected threads edition Quote
12-11-2010 , 01:18 AM
Here are some statistics from my play to illustrate my arguments baout the poker sites rigging their software to rip off good players and reward poor ones.

These are weekly results from this financial year (Australian FY)
Because I go to Uni there are periods when I played very little
Each week has the end day =- the number of Pre-Flop ALL ins I had. Then then number I actually won - then the number I should have won according to an average result based on Pokerstove's probability (e.g with over pair vs under pair you are on average 80% give or take)
then the % I was down on expectation that week -

04-Jul-10 12 4 5.71 42.75%
18-Jul-10 33 14 16.92 20.86%
11-Jul-10 86 41 47.3 15.37%
18-Jul-10 22 8 10.98 37.25%
22-Aug-10 25 12 14.54 21.17%
01-Oct-10 3 0 1.47 #DIV/0!
10-Oct-10 5 3 2.47 +17.67%
31-Oct-10 30 9 16.25 80.56%
07-Nov-10 40 14 18.43 31.64%
14-Nov-10 73 31 37.7 21.61%
21-Nov-10 50 18 26.35 46.39%
28-Nov-10 238 104 123.67 18.91%
05-Dec-10 29 11 16.08 46.18%

You will note that only had ONE week when I performed better than expected and that only had 5 results total.
This is so below reasonable expectation that it is not even close to being simply probability variations.
the main poker sites I play at are FULL TILT, POKERSTARS and ABSOLUTE. Their software is consistently and continually giving biased results against me because I am an overall winning player.
I now have a total 0f 1207 results logged from my Pokertracker hand histories.
if it were up here down there that would be different even if were significantly down overall but it is simply not even close to fair.
Over pairs vs under pairs - should be 80% - I run at 68% (139)
pairs vs 1 over card (jj vs A7 for instance) - should be around 68% - I run at 52% (141)
Overcards vs pair and pair vs overcards 206 overcards - 245 pairs - total 451 - should be about 51% - am runninf at 43.68 - nearly 15% down
overall counting pairs vs overcards as better than 50% I have got my money in at 51% or better 716 times - should have won 65% of those hands - only won 51% - 21% down on reasonable expectations - this is straight up thievery designed to keep weaker players at the tables longer than they should be and therefore paying more rake.
The great "Poker is rigged" debate - Collected threads edition Quote
12-11-2010 , 01:28 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Octavian30
Here are some statistics from my play to illustrate my arguments baout the poker sites rigging their software to rip off good players and reward poor ones.

These are weekly results from this financial year (Australian FY)
Because I go to Uni there are periods when I played very little
Each week has the end day =- the number of Pre-Flop ALL ins I had. Then then number I actually won - then the number I should have won according to an average result based on Pokerstove's probability (e.g with over pair vs under pair you are on average 80% give or take)
then the % I was down on expectation that week -

04-Jul-10 12 4 5.71 42.75%
18-Jul-10 33 14 16.92 20.86%
11-Jul-10 86 41 47.3 15.37%
18-Jul-10 22 8 10.98 37.25%
22-Aug-10 25 12 14.54 21.17%
01-Oct-10 3 0 1.47 #DIV/0!
10-Oct-10 5 3 2.47 +17.67%
31-Oct-10 30 9 16.25 80.56%
07-Nov-10 40 14 18.43 31.64%
14-Nov-10 73 31 37.7 21.61%
21-Nov-10 50 18 26.35 46.39%
28-Nov-10 238 104 123.67 18.91%
05-Dec-10 29 11 16.08 46.18%

You will note that only had ONE week when I performed better than expected and that only had 5 results total.
This is so below reasonable expectation that it is not even close to being simply probability variations.
the main poker sites I play at are FULL TILT, POKERSTARS and ABSOLUTE. Their software is consistently and continually giving biased results against me because I am an overall winning player.
I now have a total 0f 1207 results logged from my Pokertracker hand histories.
if it were up here down there that would be different even if were significantly down overall but it is simply not even close to fair.
Over pairs vs under pairs - should be 80% - I run at 68% (139)
pairs vs 1 over card (jj vs A7 for instance) - should be around 68% - I run at 52% (141)
Overcards vs pair and pair vs overcards 206 overcards - 245 pairs - total 451 - should be about 51% - am runninf at 43.68 - nearly 15% down
overall counting pairs vs overcards as better than 50% I have got my money in at 51% or better 716 times - should have won 65% of those hands - only won 51% - 21% down on reasonable expectations - this is straight up thievery designed to keep weaker players at the tables longer than they should be and therefore paying more rake.


Hopefully once you are in university you will no longer be the specific target of a coordinated multi-company global conspiracy to cause you to not be able to afford to super size your value meal with the stolen rigged EV snatched from your deserving grasp.

That is unless the university is in on it as well...
The great "Poker is rigged" debate - Collected threads edition Quote
12-11-2010 , 02:21 AM
Week PF All-ins Won Expected % < EV
04-Jul-10 12 4 5.71 42.75%
18-Jul-10 33 14 16.92 20.86%
11-Jul-10 86 41 47.3 15.37%
18-Jul-10 22 8 10.98 37.25%
22-Aug-10 25 12 14.54 21.17%
01-Oct-10 3 0 1.47 #DIV/0!
10-Oct-10 5 3 2.47 +17.67%
31-Oct-10 30 9 16.25 80.56%
07-Nov-10 40 14 18.43 31.64%
14-Nov-10 73 31 37.7 21.61%
21-Nov-10 50 18 26.35 46.39%
28-Nov-10 238 104 123.67 18.91%
05-Dec-10 29 11 16.08 46.18%

I made your wall of numbers easier to read. If you have PT though, why would you sit there and look at this all hand by hand, week by week, using PokerStove to calculate percentages when you could just do an EV graph in PT? Not only is it easier for you, it's actually readable unlike
Quote:
04-Jul-10 12 4 5.71 42.75%
etc.
The great &quot;Poker is rigged&quot; debate - Collected threads edition Quote
12-11-2010 , 05:21 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Monteroy
Retire this gimmick, create a new one in a few days with a slight alteration, and then watch as many of the shills react exactly the same as if this one had never existed. This one is pretty much dead after a short but mildly amusing run.

Keep track of how your different gimmicks do in terms of longevity and which shill reacted the most then in a while post a summary of the results. You can store the results in SM (Shill Manager).

Good luck on that adventure.
This is a good plan.

I note that Monty has reacted a lot more to the 'ken******' gimmick than to a many others.

A good start to your database.
The great &quot;Poker is rigged&quot; debate - Collected threads edition Quote
12-11-2010 , 10:46 AM
Spoiler:
The great &quot;Poker is rigged&quot; debate - Collected threads edition Quote
12-11-2010 , 12:51 PM
Stop attempting to use the word Gimmick, you guys don't understand it's definition or proper usage.
The great &quot;Poker is rigged&quot; debate - Collected threads edition Quote
12-11-2010 , 01:01 PM
Monteroy, I wasn't pushing youtube videos, you had a lot of questions for me about Magic, so i provided you a couple of links so you could get your questions satisfied from the horse's mouth. I have no agenda to push youtube videos and I am not a shill. I do enjoy your schizophrenic thought process though !!
The great &quot;Poker is rigged&quot; debate - Collected threads edition Quote
12-11-2010 , 01:58 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by MaximumPwnership
Monteroy, I wasn't pushing youtube videos, you had a lot of questions for me about Magic, so i provided you a couple of links so you could get your questions satisfied from the horse's mouth. I have no agenda to push youtube videos and I am not a shill. I do enjoy your schizophrenic thought process though !!

Feel free to go over all of my posts and quote all of the "questions for you about Magic" you seem to remember me asking. Your interpretation of reality does not always match reality itself.

Regarding whether you are a shill for it or not, as I said earlier - either you are shill for that production or you are a standard riggie that wants to believe the show.

One of your first posts was

Quote:
Originally Posted by MaximumPwnership
Check out these videos by Magic, the pokerstars suckout stepchild

http://www.youtube.com/user/magic612
so I did and in 3 minutes I was able to sharkscope the user names on the video to see the type of player the video maker was as well as the opponents. You linked his videos again and mentioned a chat room or something which I never asked about nor cared about (though it seems important to you). After, you posted the following:

Quote:
Originally Posted by MaximumPwnership
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TrptETmrYZ4

review this video: babysitted donks #1 for information
so I did a quick review and chuckled because it basically unintentionally proved the deal was actually fair. I gave the specific reasons in my analysis which you can look up again if you like. You never debated the points I made, instead going with this "you seem fascinated by this guy" angle even though you were the one who kept pushing all of his videos and shows while I have never said much more about him than he is clearly a show person who has a bit of a limited routine.

Understand that I never try that hard to make a riggie understand whether his take on reality is logical or not. Generally riggies use their own variations of logic and only when they need, so I fully expect your mind will not be changed and you will carve the world in a way to fit your beliefs.

That's cool - that's what riggies do. If you ever choose to address my direct points in a similarly direct manner I will respond, though I have no expectation you will ever do that as that is not what riggies do.

All the best.
The great &quot;Poker is rigged&quot; debate - Collected threads edition Quote
12-11-2010 , 02:04 PM
gimmick
an ingenious and usually new scheme or angle
a trick or device used to attract business or attention
The great &quot;Poker is rigged&quot; debate - Collected threads edition Quote
12-11-2010 , 02:40 PM
As a Swede have to say the Swedish national site for poker (Svenskaspel) seems pretty good. Rare to get bad beats. Oh, you guys can't join....you have to be a Swedish citizen.....
The great &quot;Poker is rigged&quot; debate - Collected threads edition Quote
12-11-2010 , 03:30 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by intelegant
As a Swede have to say the Swedish national site for poker (Svenskaspel) seems pretty good. Rare to get bad beats. Oh, you guys can't join....you have to be a Swedish citizen.....
cool story bro
The great &quot;Poker is rigged&quot; debate - Collected threads edition Quote
12-11-2010 , 04:12 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by intelegant
As a Swede have to say the Swedish national site for poker (Svenskaspel) seems pretty good. Rare to get bad beats. Oh, you guys can't join....you have to be a Swedish citizen.....
Sounds rigged to me.

I wonder if the rigtards are going to call you a shill for that site.
The great &quot;Poker is rigged&quot; debate - Collected threads edition Quote
12-11-2010 , 04:27 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by MaximumPwnership
Stop attempting to use the word Gimmick, you guys don't understand it's definition or proper usage.
Perhaps you should explain it then.
The great &quot;Poker is rigged&quot; debate - Collected threads edition Quote
12-11-2010 , 05:20 PM
Otatop

Explain to me how you mdo an EV graph in PT for just Pre- Flop All Ins..

thanks
The great &quot;Poker is rigged&quot; debate - Collected threads edition Quote
12-11-2010 , 05:21 PM
Monteroy - if you do some research on your own ALl In Pref Flop results - you might not be such a smug no it all
The great &quot;Poker is rigged&quot; debate - Collected threads edition Quote
12-11-2010 , 05:50 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Octavian30
Monteroy - if you do some research on your own ALl In Pref Flop results - you might not be such a smug no it all
lol
The great &quot;Poker is rigged&quot; debate - Collected threads edition Quote
12-11-2010 , 06:12 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Octavian30
Monteroy - if you do some research on your own ALl In Pref Flop results - you might not be such a smug no it all
My all in pre flop results have nothing to do with my innate smugness. That comes from being smarter in general and better at poker than riggies, including yourself. On the flip side, while I trump you in smugness you do have me beat when it comes to being paranoid.

If you have a specific "all in" test in mind let me know, and understand that I likely have more all-ins in a a couple weeks when I play than you have in your lifetime of cherry picked, error filled stats that you presented in a sloppy manner.

We can even compare our results if you tell me which specific filters you would like us each to present here from our respective databases complete with an explanation of why you think those specific filters are significant for your beliefs. After that we can each post screenshots of our database (HEM or Tracker) data.

Also understand that along with the multiple poker rooms and the university that I am in on the conspiracy against you. You matter that much to the world.

All the best.
The great &quot;Poker is rigged&quot; debate - Collected threads edition Quote
12-11-2010 , 06:38 PM
Monteroy: Is there an easy way to configure PT to show the EV of Pre Flop All Ins?

I can't seem to work it out being of such a lesser intelligence level.
The great &quot;Poker is rigged&quot; debate - Collected threads edition Quote

      
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