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11-06-2009 , 08:42 PM

#26

idog519

grinder

Join Date: Aug 2004 Posts: 608

Both villains show Queens.

I was content with the call, the board didn't help me tho

Full Tilt No-Limit Hold'em Tournament, 400/800 Blinds 100 Ante (8 handed) - Full-Tilt Hand Converter from HandHistoryConverter.com

MP1 (t54632)
Hero (MP2) (t33938)
MP3 (t16289)
CO (t13465)
SB (t35972)
BB (t28479)
UTG (t27326)
UTG+1 (t30560)

Hero's M: 16.97

Preflop: Hero is MP2 with A

, K

1 fold, UTG+1 bets t2400, MP1 calls t2400, Hero raises to t13000, 4 folds, UTG+1 raises to t30460 (All-In), MP1 calls t28060, Hero calls t17460

Flop: (t93380) 6

, 3

, 5

(3 players, 1 all-in)
MP1 bets t24072 (All-In), Hero calls t3378 (All-In)

Turn: (t100136) 4

(3 players, 3 all-in)

River: (t100136) 4

(3 players, 3 all-in)

Total pot: t100136

Quote

11-06-2009 , 09:06 PM

#27

Markulous

Pooh-Bah

Join Date: Jun 2008 Posts: 4,530

Quote:

Originally Posted by Recteur

we are so fked in the ass here
fistpump fold and im happy about it

3-bet/folding is so bad.

Quote

11-07-2009 , 08:29 AM

#28

Recteur

banned

Join Date: Jun 2009 Posts: 2,244

Quote:

Originally Posted by Markulous

3-bet/folding is so bad.

stfu
according to my pokerstove we have around 15% eq in the best cases
then there are some really **** ugly but yet still very probable cases where we are in really really terrible shape (like 3-4-5% eq terrible)
this is not a call
when we 3b we didnt know what was going to happen
this was the worst case scenario and now folding is correct
we have awesome odds against QQ and QQ for instance, but this is as good as it gets

Last edited by Recteur; 11-07-2009 at 08:37 AM.

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11-07-2009 , 09:31 AM

#29

Cr@ckers717

old hand

Join Date: Feb 2008 Posts: 1,407

3b/folding does suck balls, we're getting like more than 5-1 who in their right state of mind would fold. Also fwiw i think villain 1 can easily shove TT here cause as he can interpret we are squeezing. Also you get some awful players in these 24$'s. You must call after 3b, lol at folding

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11-07-2009 , 09:45 AM

#30

dereds

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Mar 2008 Posts: 16,782

Quote:

Originally Posted by Recteur

your pokerstove is wrong then obviously. Like I don't want to be results oriented but we have > 50% equity when they both turn up QQ so it is not possible that we have 15% equity in the best case.

Also for us to have <5% equity one of them must have AA and their ranges are wider than that

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11-07-2009 , 09:59 AM

#31

CaliStyle

See my staking thread

Join Date: Mar 2004 Posts: 4,356

With your chip stack and position I really only like two options. Just raising to 13,000 sucks especially OOP IMO. I either like shoving here and putting them to the test or flatting and getting out cheap if we miss and are not committing all our chips pre-flop. Since villian is pretty active I am leaning towards shoving pre unless you have reads that his early position raises are very tight.

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11-07-2009 , 10:30 AM

#32

ssnyc

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Aug 2005 Posts: 38,129

Quote:

Originally Posted by Recteur

easy dude...

if we are now in the business of 3 bet folding AK getting massive odds than we better be 100% sure they have the nizzles

Quote

11-07-2009 , 11:32 AM

#33

sjp507

banned

Join Date: Jun 2008 Posts: 2,391

Quote:

Originally Posted by Recteur

of course thats what youre pokerstove says, you think everyone has the nuts.

theres no point in using pokerstove if you cant assign ranges properly tbh

Quote

11-07-2009 , 11:36 AM

#34

Markulous

Pooh-Bah

Join Date: Jun 2008 Posts: 4,530

Quote:

Originally Posted by Recteur

lol. There's no way that is correct. Both villains have been very active, we have an M of 16, we just put in like 40% of our stack, and we're getting a bazillion to 1 odds after our 3-bet(and we have blockers). You act as if they're ubernits and we didn't just put a ton of our chips into play.

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11-07-2009 , 01:52 PM

#35

Recteur

banned

Join Date: Jun 2009 Posts: 2,244

Look , i know 3b/folding sucks OK?
We wouldnt fold to one guy , although against two guys who have shown ridicolous strength on the bubble in UTG and MP we ARE not given right odds to call, simply.
Okay we 3b and the worst scenario possible occured, so?

Dont play so **** standard all the time, omg i **** hate this forum . the avg mttstratposters here are overplaying every hand just "get it in get it in"
how many here are there really who have won an amount worth mentioning. its ok that u assume im the avg worthless mttwannabe here but please dont **** be rude when u try to lecture me

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11-07-2009 , 01:54 PM

#36

dereds

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Mar 2008 Posts: 16,782

Quote:

Originally Posted by Recteur

Look , i know 3b/folding sucks OK?
We wouldnt fold to one guy , although against two guys who have shown ridicolous strength on the bubble in UTG and MP we are not given right odds to call, simply.

what do you think their ranges are?

Quote

11-07-2009 , 01:59 PM

#37

Recteur

banned

Join Date: Jun 2009 Posts: 2,244

Quote:

Originally Posted by dereds

what do you think their ranges are?

AKo+JJ
AKs+QQ

Quote

11-07-2009 , 02:29 PM

#38

dereds

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Mar 2008 Posts: 16,782

then it is still a call and I thin your ranges are too narrow but w/e

equity win tie pots won pots tied
Hand 0: 31.104% 26.09% 05.01% 1184517432 227597034.00 { JJ+, AKs, AKo }
Hand 1: 50.386% 47.41% 02.98% 2152354080 135133842.00 { QQ+, AKs }
Hand 2: 18.510% 12.52% 05.99% 568238364 272096496.00 { AKo }

Quote

11-07-2009 , 07:23 PM

#39

sjp507

banned

Join Date: Jun 2008 Posts: 2,391

Quote:

Originally Posted by Recteur

if you were playing a tournament for your life then clearly you would fold because as shown you are likely to be a fairly big dog. but if youre playing in the level you should be then its a very easy mathematical call. to fold here yes its giving you the chance to win the tournament more often but its false logic in the long run.

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11-07-2009 , 07:33 PM

#40

Dantes

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Jun 2007 Posts: 10,833

it might be a fold if you had made a reasonably sized 3 bet

Guys, don't just auto assume that you should never 3b fold AK. Ya ya have a plan etc etc. Your plan doesn't have to include some cold 4 betting two flats and a cold 5 bet though.

edit: That said, I call here fairly happily since people do really stupid stuff chasing bounties.

Last edited by Dantes; 11-07-2009 at 07:39 PM.

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11-07-2009 , 07:43 PM

#41

Dantes

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Jun 2007 Posts: 10,833

example: Live mtt aggro player opens from ep with 30bbs and gets 1 call

I look down at AKo otb and 3 bet intending to call a shove from OR.

Nitty 70 yo guy in sb counts out a minraise then decides to 3x my raise... (I have about 80bbs and he covers)

Folds to me and I fold fairly quickly.

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