Does Whining About Political Correctness in a Racism Debate Correlate to Being a Racist? - Page 128 - Politics version 7.0 -- Two Plus Two Poker Forums

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Does Whining About Political Correctness in a Racism Debate Correlate to Being a Racist?

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10-20-2014 , 03:07 PM

#3176

spanktehbadwookie

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Apr 2009 Posts: 19,374

Quote:

Originally Posted by FoldnDark

My Mengeleian experiment would naturally involve no education to prove children are actually the beasts we all know they are.

Beastly.

10-20-2014 , 04:01 PM

#3177

David Sklansky

Administrator

Join Date: Aug 2002 Posts: 17,361

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pokerlogist

So are guys saying that only about 10% of the people in Europe and the US were true abolitionists in the 1700-1900s, but they were able the overwhelm the 90% who you say would be okay with slavery if they had them? In other words the 10% forced the 90% to end slavery?

Most northerners who were mildly against slavery would have changed their mind, whether they realized it or not, if they were in the same position as the southerners. But since they weren't in that position it was easy to choose what was right.

10-20-2014 , 04:17 PM

#3178

microbet

Solar Powered

Join Date: Jan 2005 Posts: 58,360

My wife's stepmom was a grandchild (I think) of B.F. Skinner's partner. That guy screwed up his kids. A lot of suicide in that family, including my wife's stepmom.

10-20-2014 , 06:28 PM

#3179

chezlaw

Limey Bastard

Join Date: Jan 2004 Posts: 48,952

Quote:

Originally Posted by David Sklansky

and many of the Southerners who were pro slavery would have been at least mildly anti-slavery if they had been Northerners.

Chezlaw's conjecture No 374 is that if we swapped people round it's not the case that the most anti-slavery Northerners would have become least pro-slavery Southerners etc etc.

Disclaimer: Its kinda depressing to have to add that 'chezlaw's conjecture' is self-depreciating.

10-20-2014 , 06:36 PM

#3180

Paul D

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Dec 2011 Posts: 14,689

You might want to go read a book or two about slavery and the US. Like Northerners did own slaves at one point and gave the practice up.

Cheeselaw shouldn't conjecture w/o working knowledge of history.

10-20-2014 , 06:38 PM

#3181

chezlaw

Limey Bastard

Join Date: Jan 2004 Posts: 48,952

Quote:

Originally Posted by Paul D

It might help if you thought before you talked.

10-20-2014 , 06:41 PM

#3182

Paul D

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Dec 2011 Posts: 14,689

You don't seem to think at all and constantly say you don't know about subjects you talk about. This is a case of that.

You don't get to say we could interchange people and they would do the same thing when both practiced the same thing and then one side gave it up, kapiche? That's now how philosophy, politics, or anything works.

10-20-2014 , 06:48 PM

#3183

chezlaw

Limey Bastard

Join Date: Jan 2004 Posts: 48,952

Quote:

Originally Posted by Paul D

Any Northerners who owned slaves were Northerners. They are besides the point of swapping Northerners with Southerners because we are considering the different attitudes in those two places.

10-20-2014 , 07:20 PM

#3184

Paul D

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Dec 2011 Posts: 14,689

http://civilwarcauses.org/stat.htm

You swap a Northerner with a Southerner and it's ~2/3rds likely he doesn't own a slave if you just want to go by numbers alone.

The question you should be asking yourself is: Why didn't the Northerners implement slavery in the North to the same degree as Southerners?

10-20-2014 , 07:28 PM

#3185

chezlaw

Limey Bastard

Join Date: Jan 2004 Posts: 48,952

Quote:

Originally Posted by Paul D

http://civilwarcauses.org/stat.htm

You swap a Northerner with a Southerner and it's ~2/3rds likely he doesn't own a slave if you just want to go by numbers alone.

Still missing the point

Quote:

The question you should be asking yourself is: Why didn't the Northerners implement slavery in the North to the same degree as Southerners?

That is indeed one of the questions. Unless you're some unusual sort of racist or claiming the groups were self-selecting in some way then it's not because the people were different in any fundamental sort of way i.e. they weren't inherently better or worse people.

If you want to delve into the specific history then I cant go there because I'm ignorant. However that's nothing to with the point.

10-20-2014 , 07:32 PM

#3186

aoFrantic

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Apr 2007 Posts: 25,218

Isn't it just pretty obvious that slavery was beneficial for plantation owners but not for the lifestyles in the north? It's the same reason the hypothetical of slavery today is dumb. Most people have no use for a slave, rich people get a maid/nanny if they need too and that's just the 20th century version.

10-20-2014 , 07:48 PM

#3187

MrWookie

Don't Call Me Meredith

Join Date: Feb 2005 Posts: 94,159

BruceZ, on consent:

Quote:

Originally Posted by BruceZ

He summoned her to France after he was already there in 1787. She came at age 14 and stayed with him willingly for 2 years. Then she conceived her first child. It isn't even clear that she conceived in France. It could have been shortly after they returned to Monticello.

At least Bruno Ganz has a long list of other characters he's played.

10-20-2014 , 07:53 PM

#3188

DudeImBetter

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Feb 2012 Posts: 10,665

Pretty sure the age of consent even in contemporary France is 14. TJ could impregnate that girl tonight and face no legal consequences.

10-20-2014 , 08:03 PM

#3189

MrWookie

Don't Call Me Meredith

Join Date: Feb 2005 Posts: 94,159

Dibbers, on consent:

Quote:

Originally Posted by DudeImBetter

Pretty sure the age of consent even in contemporary France is 14. TJ could impregnate that girl tonight and face no legal consequences.

He doesn't even claim to be a character. He's just an idiot.

10-20-2014 , 08:04 PM

#3190

DudeImBetter

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Feb 2012 Posts: 10,665

Google tells me it's 15 and not 14. So be it.

10-20-2014 , 08:05 PM

#3191

FoldnDark

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Jun 2009 Posts: 11,930

Dude, Wook isn't interested in condemning the many people from that time who raped children, it's that TJ raped his slave that gets him off.

10-20-2014 , 08:07 PM

#3192

MrWookie

Don't Call Me Meredith

Join Date: Feb 2005 Posts: 94,159

Quote:

Originally Posted by DudeImBetter

Google tells me it's 15 and not 14. So be it.

You are still missing a piece of the puzzle.

10-20-2014 , 08:29 PM

#3193

Tien

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Oct 2005 Posts: 8,928

Grunching.

Thomas Jefferson raped his slaves and didn't free them after his death?

And BruceZ defending this? Is this the tale of the tape so far?

Don't have the mental energy to dig through the facts.

10-20-2014 , 08:42 PM

#3194

FoldnDark

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Jun 2009 Posts: 11,930

Some are defending TJ, not his actions. Others are condemning TJ, certain they'd have done better.

10-20-2014 , 08:53 PM

#3195

chezlaw

Limey Bastard

Join Date: Jan 2004 Posts: 48,952

Quote:

Originally Posted by FoldnDark

Some are defending TJ, not his actions. Others are condemning TJ, certain they'd have done better.

Some of us are doing neither. I'm not defending TJ or condemning him certain I've have done better. His not in the top ~10% that seems fairly clear, how bad he is among the rest I'm very unsure about but not finding myself very sympathetic towards him.

I certainly like to think I'd have done better but then so do all of us.

10-20-2014 , 08:55 PM

#3196

spanktehbadwookie

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Apr 2009 Posts: 19,374

Quote:

Originally Posted by MrWookie

BruceZ, on consent:

At least Bruno Ganz has a long list of other characters he's played.

So explain your non-specific implications. Is it that slaves can do things willingly or is that people considered of age, (even close to of age)can do do things willingly?

Did you plug your mind-reader in to determine the writer's true intent this time or do you "prove it" by asserting an opinion about it with an mock air of authority?

10-20-2014 , 09:08 PM

#3197

DudeImBetter

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Feb 2012 Posts: 10,665

Quote:

Originally Posted by MrWookie

You are still missing a piece of the puzzle.

I'm ducking in and out of this thread. What am I missing?

10-20-2014 , 09:55 PM

#3198

metaname2

self-banned

Join Date: Dec 2003 Posts: 3,996

Quote:

Originally Posted by FoldnDark

Others are condemning TJ, certain they'd have done better.

This is about the tenth time someone has said this. Is this the world's laziest strawman or can you really not imagine someone criticizing Jefferson without it being about their own self-aggrandizement? What was your reaction to that Dave Chappelle clip someone posted earlier?

10-20-2014 , 10:07 PM

#3199

Trolly McTrollson

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Oct 2010 Posts: 38,360

I would have done a ****load better if I was TJ. I would have built the first electric motor, told Franklin he was wrong about electric currents, and I would have also invented cocaine.