Obviously I don't pay off with aces up in this particular hand because he drew 2 and showed me what he has. However mostly they are smart enough to draw 1 and that's towards what my question is geared.

With JJ-AA I am really unsure whether to call a 3 bet (both IP and OOP) and for the most part I just fold especially at 10c/20c because they seldom get aggro with draws unlike at $2/$4+. You definitely see opens with draws but mostly its limps/cold calls, whereas in a 2/4 or 3/6 game it's common to see 3 bets and sometimes even caps with draws.

Also you tend to see people just flat low two pair. And I am beginning to think that is possibly the right play (or fold). So that influences my decision when facing a 3 bet at 10c/20c because their range is so much more pat hands and trips (or seems it).

I feel with aces you probably have to call a 3 bet, but with kings or below you can definitely just dump.

LV I have a solution for yours problem.

Instead of wondering whether you should(n't) call a 3-bet with one pair in FL, move up in stakes and you'll wonder whether you should(n't) call postdraw with unimproved one pair.

And also if you have an option - play drunk, it helps:

Yeah it's weird, coz I have a job dealing, and I'm being a massive nit with my money. I want to save up $50k (~£31k) to play FL mixed games+live in America. FL is non existent in England, all non holdem games played pot limit. A disaster for minbettors such as myself!

So it means I am reluctant, at least while I am in the early stages of saving, to put down any proper money for poker. Disciplined with BR as I am, this means I play the stakes my BR allows. With $14 in my PS account, the lowest draw game is all I can play. Oh, and $0.02/$0.04 LHE/O8 and $0.04c/$0.08 Stud games, and the smallest sit and gos.

Question for you Huricano, how do you get PokerHands to work now? Stars changed the HH format meaning it is no longer compatible, thus rendering the no longer maintained PokerHands useless to me (or so it seems). With regards to that FPDB software, I have no idea how to get that working, and would pay $10 to anyone who can set it up and tell me exactly how to work it without issue.

$14 is enough for FL 0.25$/0.5$ 5 card draw
AFAIR I drop ~15$ once with about 30k-50k hands behind me.

Here is my actual version of PokerHands:
http://www.sendspace.pl/file/7be34c074b6a75e4b471dc4

(if it's in Polish then "pobierz"=download)

It requires .NET Framework 4.0 and PostgreSQL database to work.

Not enough for 4 tables IMO!

Ty, I have some minor experience with Polish, been there, great country.

You're saying this version works with the latest PS HH's?

4*3$=12$ so you still have 2$ behind to cover some 5cd swings
Yea it should work, I was playing yesterday and everything was OK.

Does your Hud work Huricano?

Poker Stars $0.50/$1.00 Limit 5 Card Draw - 6 players - View hand 1955855
DeucesCracked Poker Videos Hand History Converter

Pre Draw: (1.5 SB) Hero is SB with Q 9 9 8 5
UTG folds, MP folds, CO folds, BTN folds, Hero raises, BB 3-bets, Hero folds

First orbit, BB unknown. Is this standard?

IMO yeah. Drawing to <KK puts you in bad spots when you hit trips and crap 2 pair, so bad reverse implied odds, whereas if you are simply called you don't have to worry so much. .: the initial open is fine. If a guy is defending his blind heavily, especially with 3 bets, back off and let him own himself when you have a hand and he hasn't realised you adjusted. I can give this advice, because I am that 3 betting guy.

Plus you are oop...

Once you build history with people you get a feel for if they will resteal with draws.

No, It's not standard.

If you fold this you are heavy exploitable by BB, but even if he only 3-bet with legitimate hands (KK/AA+) (and on 0.5/1$ It's mostly wider!) you are still to OK to gamble getting 1:5

EDIT:
Ohhhhh...so yes, fold pre is standard

Autocall to the 3-bet otherwise you should not open IMO. If I see that once I will pound you with any random 5 cards.

OK so what if it's the same situation I posted, but I have AK or 22-55?

For me there is little difference between these hands. You still cannot call post UI without info, so better to save the third SB pre rather than calling then x/fing all day

If the BB is never trying to exploit you, then call roughly based on equity or if you have a good simulation program, on approximate EV. Even if you know the BB is never trying to play exploitively, the other players at the table will notice if you often fold to the 3-bet from this spot and will attempt to outplay you in the future. You can't always call the 3-bet because hands like AK, 22 and 33 are quite weak and don't have great equity.

Suppose you only look at your range of AK+ ( excluding semibluffs such as flush/straight draws ): there are 164(960)+1296420 = 1453860 combinations ( and technically, not each of these combinations are equally likely because of the card removal effects; e.g., after four folds, aces and kings are more likely than the other ranks, but ignore these effects ). So as not to be exploitable, you need to call at least the top 3/5 of the range of AK+, which means you need to at least call with 77+. If the BB is semibluffing with a draw or AK/AQ ( not likely at the low limits ), you need to defend more often as those "rags" the BB is 3-betting with still have decent equity since you often only have one pair.

So if you were opening with AK+ and semibluffs, I'd recommend you call the 3-bet with 66 and 55, fold 22 and AK. As for 33 and 44, it's probably best to use judgment and consider metagame consequences.

Hi mangler, we just played some 10c/20c, you know my Stars sn?

Can confirm it does work.

HUD not working yet.

If you are using something different than WinXP, try to run it as a admin/manager or however you call it in English.

I just made an account for this thread!

Just start playing fl 5cd. Read articles on pokerstrategy.com and then I was looking for more content. This thread helped me already a lot

When I did install pokerhands, I will post some hands to discuss.

got some problems with Pokerhands. Does anyone knows why Pokerhands doesnt import my hands? He import the .txt files from the right directory as you can see. But he don't import the hand

Download Huricano's version. I had the same problems as you. The PH from its own thread doesn't work with Stars latest version. Huricano's does. It's on page 17 of this thread.

abcdefg1991. Nice.

Well, it works for me. Are you sure you have the latest version? The modification date of the exe is April 25th.

Thnx for the fast replys

I installed the newer version and it works fine now. Will play a session today en post hands where I'm not sure what to do.

Played a short session and find 2 hands where I dont know what the best option is.

Sorry for not converting the hands. Handconverter didnt work

Hand 1:
vs unknown. I think this is an easy cap pre-draw? What is our minimum range we cap in this spot?

PokerStars Hand #88189479741: 5 Card Draw Limit ($0.25/$0.50 USD) - 2012/10/25 12:46:07 CET [2012/10/25 6:46:07 ET]
Table 'Cevenola III' 6-max Seat #3 is the button
Seat 1: CRAZY-08 ($3.84 in chips)
Seat 2: Tech.Man.Yar ($8.63 in chips)
Seat 3: ADeaconu99 ($5.43 in chips)
Seat 4: abcdefg1991 ($10.22 in chips)
Seat 5: Bilousss ($13.53 in chips)
Seat 6: 7ARmed ($8.15 in chips)
abcdefg1991: posts small blind $0.10
Bilousss: posts big blind $0.25
*** DEALING HANDS ***
Dealt to abcdefg1991 [Qc Qs Qd 6h 4d]
7ARmed: folds
CRAZY-08: folds
Tech.Man.Yar: folds
ADeaconu99: folds
abcdefg1991: raises $0.25 to $0.50
Bilousss: raises $0.25 to $0.75
abcdefg1991: calls $0.25
abcdefg1991: discards 1 card [4d]
Dealt to abcdefg1991 [Qc Qs Qd 6h] [3d]
Bilousss: discards 3 cards
abcdefg1991: bets $0.50
Bilousss: calls $0.50
*** SHOW DOWN ***
abcdefg1991: shows [Qc Qs Qd 6h 3d] (three of a kind, Queens)
Bilousss: mucks hand
abcdefg1991 collected $2.39 from pot
*** SUMMARY ***
Total pot $2.50 | Rake $0.11
Seat 1: CRAZY-08 folded before the Draw (didn't bet)
Seat 2: Tech.Man.Yar folded before the Draw (didn't bet)
Seat 3: ADeaconu99 (button) folded before the Draw (didn't bet)
Seat 4: abcdefg1991 (small blind) showed [Qc Qs Qd 6h 3d] and won ($2.39) with three of a kind, Queens
Seat 5: Bilousss (big blind) mucked [Ks 7c 4c Kh Jh]
Seat 6: 7ARmed folded before the Draw (didn't bet)

Hand 2:
Should I call this bet post-draw? I think he will bet only 2pair and better. I think we should fold becaus our 2pair is under the median?

PokerStars Hand #88189535757: 5 Card Draw Limit ($0.25/$0.50 USD) - 2012/10/25 12:49:42 CET [2012/10/25 6:49:42 ET]
Table 'Cevenola III' 6-max Seat #4 is the button
Seat 1: CRAZY-08 ($5.79 in chips)
Seat 2: Tech.Man.Yar ($8.03 in chips)
Seat 3: ADeaconu99 ($6.31 in chips)
Seat 4: abcdefg1991 ($10.76 in chips)
Seat 5: Bilousss ($11.53 in chips)
Seat 6: 7ARmed ($7.05 in chips)
Bilousss: posts small blind $0.10
7ARmed: posts big blind $0.25
*** DEALING HANDS ***
Dealt to abcdefg1991 [2d Qh Th Td 9c]
CRAZY-08: folds
Tech.Man.Yar: folds
ADeaconu99: calls $0.25
abcdefg1991: raises $0.25 to $0.50
Bilousss: folds
7ARmed: calls $0.25
ADeaconu99: calls $0.25
7ARmed: discards 3 cards
ADeaconu99: discards 3 cards
abcdefg1991: discards 3 cards [2d Qh 9c]
Dealt to abcdefg1991 [Th Td] [6h Ks 6c]
7ARmed: bets $0.50
ADeaconu99: folds
abcdefg1991: calls $0.50
*** SHOW DOWN ***
7ARmed: shows [Kd 6s 4h Kc Kh] (three of a kind, Kings)
abcdefg1991: mucks hand
7ARmed collected $2.48 from pot
*** SUMMARY ***
Total pot $2.60 | Rake $0.12
Seat 1: CRAZY-08 folded before the Draw (didn't bet)
Seat 2: Tech.Man.Yar folded before the Draw (didn't bet)
Seat 3: ADeaconu99 folded after the Draw
Seat 4: abcdefg1991 (button) mucked [6h Ks Th Td 6c]
Seat 5: Bilousss (small blind) folded before the Draw
Seat 6: 7ARmed (big blind) showed [Kd 6s 4h Kc Kh] and won ($2.48) with three of a kind, Kings

For 5CD use a Dueces Cracked hand converter:
http://www.handconverter.com/

Poker Stars $0.25/$0.50 Limit 5 Card Draw - 6 players - View hand 1962874
DeucesCracked Poker Videos Hand History Converter

Pre Draw: (1.4 SB) Hero is SB with Q Q Q 6 4
7ARmed folds, CRAZY-08 folds, Tech.Man.Yar folds, ADeaconu99 folds, Hero raises, Bilousss 3-bets, Hero calls

First Draw: (6 SB) (2 players)
Hero draws 1, Bilousss draws 3
Hand: Q Q Q 6 3
Hero bets, Bilousss calls

Final Pot: 5 BB
Hero shows Q Q Q 6 3 (three of a kind, Queens)
Bilousss mucks K K J 7 4
Hero wins 4.78 BB
(Rake: $0.11)

Bilousss 3-betting range in this spot is at least QQ+, so it's not spewy to simply cap 2pair+, however if you have a Queen to Ace as a 5th card you need slightly better hand since now It's less likely that he hold only one pair.
OTOH calling with low to mid two pair and lead into him when he draw 3 might be a better option, since players rarely fold high pair once they decide to 3-bet.

Poker Stars $0.25/$0.50 Limit 5 Card Draw - 6 players - View hand 1962881
DeucesCracked Poker Videos Hand History Converter

Pre Draw: (1.4 SB) Hero is BTN with Q T T 9 2
CRAZY-08 folds, Tech.Man.Yar folds, ADeaconu99 calls, Hero raises, Bilousss folds, 7ARmed calls, ADeaconu99 calls

First Draw: (6.4 SB) (3 players)
7ARmed draws 3, ADeaconu99 draws 3, Hero draws 3
Hand: K T T 6 6
7ARmed bets, ADeaconu99 folds, Hero calls

Final Pot: 5.2 BB
Hero mucks K T T 6 6
7ARmed shows K K K 6 4 (three of a kind, Kings)
7ARmed wins 4.96 BB
(Rake: $0.12)

The basic question is: why do you iso-raise with such a weak hand?
Most of the time you don't even beat limper range and there are still two players behind! Unless limper has high 40 vpip you are better of folding.

As played easy fold postflop 7ARmed always beats you here and likely never bluff 3-way OOP without initiative when everybody draws 3.
(like most players)

Just one side note:
Try to make better table selection instead of playing with Russian ******s.
7ARmed, Bilousss and Tech.Man.Yar are far better than a 5cd newbie.
Even if you have an edge, you won't beat them much above the rake.

QQQ easy cap. TT is a fold in that position and those sidecards.