i posted this in the internet section and thought i'd post this here as well in case some of u don't venture out of the stud forums

hi,

i noticed there are a lot of posts lately about ft catching cheaters at various games.

i play only 7 card stud hi games and got reimbursed today from them.

i wonder if they are cracking down on cheating more now since we are seeing so many of these types of threads.

i would like to add that i play mostly 2/4 3/6 & 5/10 limits.

i talked to cyndy violette who plays the same games & she got back 200$ +.

Interesting. I also play a lot of 7 stud hi at FTP at 3/6, 2/4 and 1/2.

Do you have any idea over what period of time the cheating took place?

Do you have any idea who any of the cheaters are?

I have noticed more foreign players at the 7 stud tables during the last few months, esp. Chinese. I'm wondering if this cheating may have been similar to the Chinese stud mob cheating that took place at PS several months ago.

i have no idea when. i stopped playing at full tilt about a month ago. got tired of the ridic beats.

wish they would give us more info like when & where if not who.

They will never give you more information. The same xxxxxxx happened in some PLO games. Some 5/10 players have been involved and asked about the nicknames. Result: a stupid answer saying that they cannot tell who they were.

PS: Again .... stupid FTP policies ...

I cant believe that there is a refund at those levels of stud hi and I didnt get any . . . .

You should be proud, because the only explanation is that you have outstanding table selection skills and ended up avoiding the cheaters.

Hahaha...that just means you took their money

through cheating

If I am cheating, I am doing it wrong.

Dear Ceegee,

The Full Tilt Poker Security department has recently concluded an extensive investigation and we have determined that some of your opponents were in violation of our site terms.

We have permanently closed all of the offending accounts. In cases of proven cheating, 100% of the confiscated funds are returned to the players who were victimized. The reimbursement calculation is based on the number of tournaments or hands played against the offending players, and the amount won or lost against them.

We have determined that you are entitled to a refund of $342.70 which will be placed in your account in the next 72 hours.

For a number of reasons, we are unable to provide any other additional information regarding this case, including the players involved and the game type where it occurred. We thank you for your understanding in this regard. The vigilance of our players in reporting suspicious behavior is an important addition to our ongoing diligence against unethical conduct, and we carefully investigate every concern of suspicious activity.

If you believe you have witnessed unfair play at our tables, please don't hesitate to contact us at [email protected]. If there is any other way we can be of assistance, please let us know.

Full Tilt Poker Security

stars has a LOT of explaining to do if the same cheaters play on stars.

wait, you mean full tilt is awesome, and stars sucks? has anyone ever posted about getting a stars refund from w/e? or did they just sweep the changles under the rug?

As for two months ago PStars was splitting the Changle/Fuzhous up, only allowing one per table. I havent played played PStars in Oct, so I am unsure if this continued.

that's what I meant. if they had to take that step, they probably should have taken other ones as well.

And this goes back years...think of the refunds that would be involved in this if PS took this kinda action. Kudos to FT for manning up.

Well I play stud on FT but rarely higher than 1/2, and usually one to three steps lower. But I still feel sorry for myself when I lose, no matter how small the amount, so can I have some free money back too?

They sent me $60.16 randomly yesterday and I was kind of wondering why as I hadn't played on Full Tilt in awhile. So it has to have been someone/or group that's played on FT longer than 6 months.

Isn't this kinda like busting an organized crime family and sending them to separate cities instead of to jail?

Sadly, I seem to be in the same boat.

From about March through August of this year, I ran worse than I ever have in over five years of playing on FTP. I eventually had to stop playing 3/6 and 2/4. I dropped down to playing .50/1 and 1/2 stud in September and have turned things around the last two months.

However, if this cheating took place during the summer at the levels posted, I'm very surprised that I didn't play on some of those tables.

AFAIK, PS has only refunded money with respect to these Chinese colluders.

And, as you can see by the other active thread ITF about PS stud cheaters, it seems that in spite of the PS ban against them playing at the same tables, it may still be a problem there.

I practically prop the 8/16+ Stud Hi games on FTP and I didnt get anything either, so I'm not sure what the range of refunds was.

If you got a refund, post the limits you play and the time-range of when you played the most in those games over the last year.

Unless these cheaters were strictly only playing 5/10 and/or stud tournies, it definitely seems odd that neither of us received anything from FTP.

I have sent FTP an e-mail inquiring about my status. I'll let you know what they reply.

I play Razz exclusively between .05/.10 and 3/6 but primarily .50/1 and 1/2 and I got 7 bucks FWIW. I haven't heard of any other Razz players getting anything.

Collusion in Stud-games will happen in Stud Hi. Quick explanation: equities run very close together until 5th street, so 2 players can put in 66% of the chips and even though they have around ~60% equity, they can jam a player out greater than 6% of time to make this profitable.

I think it really sucks that there is no independent group of trustworthy individuals who can investigate cases like these without bias. It happens from time to time that some very good 2p2ers like Noah get asked by the sites to do investigations, but if the sites don't open up to anyone else we are expected to trust their security teams and their decisions without even being allowed to ask for more information due to the "security issues." I've been told there's some yellowcake in Niger.

It's especially troubling because both Full Tilt's and Stars' security departments have committed epic fail upon epic fail, and they are still the most trustworthy out there.