I dont tip the cloakroom girls.

I am going to resist helping turn ANOTHER thread on 2 + 2 into a tipping thread

Never tipped the cloakroom. I will tip the gents guy if he can throw me some banter. Why did I come to this thread? Oh yeah, have I just been unlucky or has the 2/5, 5/10 stopped running outside of peak at the Vic? The last few times I've been it's just been 1/1 to 1/3 and then some high stakes mix game and the 10/20+ with FullFlush etc.

Whenever I turn up it seems to be running. I play the 1/2 and 1/3 though and been running like god.

Hey, thanks for the response! this looks perfect. I'm back in the UK for 3 weeks and was wanting to play a tourney + treat my brother, who is a recreational player, to a Xmas present tourney.

London's pretty far from where I'll be but if my bro will drive us down then I'm there

Hendon Mob.

Well of course I called to win the pot, but the rules state he must show first. If he neglects to show and surrenders his hand, I don't see how it can ever be a split pot.

As for the collusion thing, if anyone suspects collusion they're well within their rights to ask to see either hand (I guess before they end up in the muck).

Anyway. This might be old news, but I got an email from Aspers today (first ever email from them). It was some poker newsletter and it turns out Aspers will be hosting the WPT London this year. They're also hosting the Betfair Live, PKR Live, the "IPO" (whatever that is?) and some PaddyPower events.

http://www.aspersstratford.co.uk/pok...m_medium=email

The sooner you get over being a rules nit the better you will do as all the donuts will like you more and feel less resentful when they do their money to you. The rules don't really matter. You won the pot. Move on.

You're a very angry man.

Not really at all. It's just that I've been in games where people demand to see their opponent's hand and follow the letter of the law and I've been in games where the person who thinks they are winning shows first. The latter were always the much better games, both from a financial and enjoyment perspective. If a recreational player is embarrassed into showing his third pair then he will be less jovial and will concentrate more on the game itself, probably playing tighter.

Yeah i didnt read that post in an angry voice in my head, perfectly reasonable thing to say, if you thought that was angry you might be getting defensive.

Part of the problem with rules nits is that they dont necessarily make sure that all rules are enforced when it doesnt suit them. Whether thats because they are angle-shooters or just not paying attention to 100% of pots that dont involve them doesnt matter. They run the risk of appearing to be angle-shooters. Just relax, play your cards and dont try to win money through technicalities, win through being better at poker. Also, what guy above said.

Was anyone witness to this?

http://www.facebook.com/AspersStratf...18805384848310

Cliffs: Large brawl at Aspers, comments seem to suggest it involved bottles glass and belts.

I've never demanded to see someone's hand. What I've talked about is the opposite...

I think trying to belittle someone by calling them a 'rules nit' is pretty hostile and far from reasonable. Now apparently I am (or appear to be) an angleshooter. Of course the rules matter. Everyone has entered some rules debate in some shape or form at the table.

Dude stop taking things so personally, ive never met you, these are the first posts of yours that ive seen. Noones trying to belittle anyone.

Ok. I just don't see how a legitimate complaint ended up with whatever it is this is. Regardless of how much the rules matter to anyone, I think it's only reasonable that dealers and FMs are reading from the same hymn sheet.

Anyway. Let's move on.

The facebook page doesn't tell you much, this story from Tripadvisor on the other hand...

http://www.tripadvisor.co.uk/ShowUse...n_England.html

Cliffs? Aspers is ****, don't go there.

Also, why the **** would you go all the way from Nottingham just to go to Aspers? There are much better places in London AND I've been to Gala Nottingham several times, there's nothing wrong with it, it's great. As is Circus and Alea. Save yourself the money and journey, you have three decent casinos in Nottingham (and DTD), be grateful.

forcing a player to turn their hand when you know your holding the best is a douche move imo, hurts the mood at the table, getting peoples backs up rather than making it a friendly experience, bad for the live game.

I completely agree with above but does anyone else feel that there is a mucking epidemic in cash games where some ppl just need to man up and flip the cards to keep the hands per hour ticking along? (in some cases where it can go on for a few mins)

Or is that just me...?

Maybe i just find live too slow.

i never see any security in the casinos round the london area (can't speak for outside haven't had the chance to play there yet ) Palms is good, fox doesn't but at the same time its hard to get out of there , but wouldn't be enoguh to break up a brawl

I know it's been said before so many times but I feel I have to say it again:

MESSAGE TO LONDON REGS, STOP TREATING THE FISH BADLY.

I went to a few different venues a few days ago, everywhere I played I could still see signs of this.

It isn't just about verbally berating the fish, it's also about laughing at plays they make, making a point to blank them or ignore them when they make a bad play. Treating fish with shortstacks especially badly. Talking in obvious code in front of them about how badly they played. Rolling eyes. Trying to get floor rulings against them in marginal cases (RE string bets or similar). Saying nice hand sarcastically a lot after a badly played hand, they aren't braindead you know, they can tell you're making fun of them. Calling for draws to come against them or calling for them to lose hands.

The list is endless, admittedly the older players are the worst culprits, but the younger players have a lot to learn too. I know it's frustrating to get stacked when the gutshot draw hits on the river or whatever, but it shouldn't matter. Even the subtlest of behaivours can turn fish off playing live, or altogether. I was talking to someone on the day and they were complaining about how even the staff treated them badly, especially when they wanted to cash out after a win.

In case you haven't noticed, the live poker economy isn't booming in the UK at all, this isn't 2009, you can't get away with **** like this anymore and expect them to come back. If you care at all about making money then make the extra effort, adapt to the times, it's not just the big things, the small things make a difference too. You really need to work on your table manner, or if you can't, don't say anything at all. It's much better to have a quiet player than one who chases away the fish, even if their actions are subtle, people still pick up on it.

Ridiculous, I would expect this sort of behaivour at Aspers and maybe Empire, but Fox and the Vic? Come on.

cant agree more

I've had this argument quite a lot online (when it's live people tend to shut up when I talk to them about it, as discussed earlier. By talk I mean mock). The problem is that some people honestly think it's no big deal and that the fish will keep coming back because they can't help it.

It's a generalised contempt for people who know less than them and it's hard to change people's minds on that. I bet the people who do this, if they read these posts, will just skim them and say it's different when they do it. That's why I mock the berators instead but I concede the possibility that that's because I'm just not a very nice person.

It happens so much at the Fox. Old regs just berating fish for playing so badly. You just want to jump up and tell them to STFU.

Last month one of the regs busts a fish (only for like £40) and he went off on one. Eventually the fish decided to go home. I just turn round to him and ask "Do you hate money?"

You SHOULD jump up and tell them to STFU. I do.

They're insulting people's intelligence (among other things) so they are opening themselves up to receiving the same as far as I'm concerned. The rooms should be very active on this stuff but they aren't.

Figure out what they're insecure about and attack it imo.