Just a therotical question, if the people who the cheaters lost large sums to HU get to keep their money whats to keep colluders in the future from winning large amounts at 6max and dumping it to unrelated accounts HU?

why would we close a thread on an unresolved major issue?

yeah andrew, this is a really good question

you caught me. my talking about how no HSNL player has ever given me mid-hand advice nor have i ever given anybody any was definitely a huge confession!

i don't even use IM but once a month or so, i hate IMing so much

Best of luck with all the legitimate claims against the cheaters on FTP... But just something that I was wondering about that I haven't seen mentioned in this thread: You're playing for 100,000's of dollars, has Full Tilt any process in place where they can contact their high-stakes players via telephone? I'd just feel so sketched out having to communicate via email when dealing with these amounts.

wasnt trying to catch you, i just find it odd that it is accepted practice. imo, players shouldnt be able to communicate without everyone being able to hear/read what they are talking about. that is why you are only allowed to speak one language at a live poker table.

um, no. you're only allowed to speak english at the table because otherwise players could cheat without anybody knowing. it's not because the casino cares whether you get to understand the jokes they're telling. if i'm chatting with somebody on IM and we never give each other unfair information, there's no reason why the communication should be made public.

if the principle were really "players shouldn't be able to communicate without everyone being able to hear" then it would be messed up for two players to go on a smoke break at he casino and talk about how awful that donk is at the table, but not only is this common it also seems totally innocuous

time to take alleged out of the thread title, no?

FTP confirmed it, so yes.

zzzzzzzzzzzzzz i wish they would just pay us already, i sent an email yesterday saying how much longer... anyone know?

Dear VPIP100,

The Full Tilt Poker Security and Fraud department has recently concluded an extensive investigation of our No Limit Hold'em cash games. We have determined that some of your opponents were in violation of the site terms, specifically for colluding with each other. We have permanently closed all of the offending accounts.

In cases of proven cheating, 100% of the confiscated funds are returned to the players who were victimized. The reimbursement calculation is based on the number of hands played against the offending players, and the amount won or lost against them.

We have determined that you are entitled to a refund of $3341.64, which will be placed in your account in the next 48 hours.

For a number of reasons, we are unable to provide any other additional information regarding this case. We thank you for your understanding in this regard.

The vigilance of our players in reporting suspicious behavior is an important addition to our ongoing diligence against unethical conduct, and we carefully investigate every concern of suspicious activity. If you believe you have witnessed unfair play at our tables, please don't hesitate to contact us at security@fulltiltpoker.com.

If there is any other way we can be of assistance, please let us know.

Thank you,

Full Tilt Poker

Got $880 back.

$3279.52

i guess they arent reimbursing based on hands played!

We have determined that you are entitled to a refund of $1606.61

I dont have too much experience in cash games, but i have played 10/20 nl and did play quite a decent amount of 5/10 on stars etc....

I havent read this whole thread, but that first HH where he shoved with T high is really really bad and probably is cheating... but unless there were multiple cases of suspicious play. I dont think that making a play like that should be reason to reimburse u.

My reasons are because u dont know for sure if the guy is just a rich fish, or if he's a good monkey and knows you're not gonna make that call without having the nuts. I really think FTP just reacted the way they did because u guys are regulars on the forums and on ftp. If u didnt report it u think they would have caught it? obv not..

What are you talking about?

how did FTP even come up with how much they owed u? its impossible.. i know the post i made 2 seconds ago was hard to understand... but what im saying is this... even with them cheating, its not like they're going to win 100% of the time. you're gonna win some too... and in a 6 max game what happens when the cheaters win some $ off one guy, but lose it to another guy? How do u fairly compensate the person who lost money illegitimately and how/why would u punish the person who gained funds legitimately. This is why online poker will never be completely approved by governments. its too much of a grey area.

1) Even if you are entitled to funds which u lost illegitimately, its impossible to come up with an exact amount.
2) If the cheaters won money illegitimately, then won some $ legitimately.. does the person who lost money legitimately at a heads up table get his money back?
3) What if the cheaters crushed a 6-max table but ended up losing it all back legitimately heads up to someone... does/will FTP reimburse the players (<-- i highly doubt this)?

lets face it... cheating is a part of poker and u gotta learn to deal with it. There should be rules of HOW FTP takes care of the victims who are cheated out of their money.... stating something like "its impossible to cheat here because we have an A+ security team" is not good enough. they gotta give clearer rules of how they handle this.

Maybe if you read the thread you would realize how ******ed you sound.

Also I got $675 back

If the cheaters won money @ 6 max then decided to dump it all to someone like durrr or ivey going all in everyhand pf... im pretty sure that would look suspicious... but its not like durrr or ivey could help it if some guy is going all in preflop every hand. So if that was the case im pretty sure everyone here would be blaming someone legitimate for doing nothing wrong. (i know im getting ahead of myself but still)

edit: i understand why someone would raise the pot with 54 when utg raises to 300 and u get 2 callers... but what everyone here is saying is that the guy can't make a bigger reraise without it being considered cheating.

with all that said, it does suck that this happened but i think there should be more rules/regulations so that when this happens in the future (which it will) FTP can handle the situation faster/better. also it lets us players know what we are getting into

Etizzle,

Since you were a big winner in the game, but played a substantial amount of hands with the cheaters, and got $0 back, that would mean they are doing it by how much you lost in the game or something similar.

In that case.....I lost over $100k in the game and got refunded $11k, what is going on here?

I've talked to two other players so far who lost $50k and got refunded $5k back, and another player who lost about $70k and got $10k back. This makes no sense.

i'd guess i lost like 25-40k and got 3300 back

what did u guys expect though... FTP is gonna willingly pay you guys outta their own pockets? Stars doesnt even do this. this is what i think happened.

cheaters ripped u guys off. they lost a good chunk of money to ppl legitimately. ftp shut down their accounts and is reimbursing u guys with the funds still in their account now. i think that is all...

got 18.5k back... guess none of us are gonna get back what we thought... they dumped too much money hu.

they clearly state what they are doing: