So support for TN v1 is "ending soon". Does this mean the next time PS updates and TN v1 breaks, u wont be fixing it making it complete garbage?

Money grabbing whores.

Well, good thing Pokerstars now have native hotkeys. Won't need this overprice software.

So you want me to upgrade to your new version that has no new features that I care about and start shipping you $20 per month?

GTFO

faq of TN2 that explains how our software will be useless in short period of time:
(which btw you didnt even care to e-mail your clients)

http://hm2faq.holdemmanager.com/ques...ns+%28TN2%29#2

thieves

downloaded TN2 trial. all i wanted to have FOLD on one button for PS and FT.
And you now what - TN2 doesnt work. At all. I dont know whats the problem - but its like it doesnt start. For PS or FT- doesnt matter.
No frames,no tabe under mouse - nothing. TN2 doesnt see my poker clients at all.
Ideas?

Subscription based model is fine but the pricing is outrageous. Both ICMIZER and HoldemResources Calculator cost way less and, unlike the TN, those tools are irreplaceable for any sng/tournament player. I would gladly pay a similar montly/yearly price to support the devs but 20$monthly/150$ yearly is just greedy given you can just use AHK for free, Stars have their own multitabling options and you don't even support that many sites to begin with, unless something have changed and the TN2 supports other networks such as merge, ipoker, microgaming etc.

so i updated and import from tn1 OBV doestnt work ... [x] click bet - doestnt work, increment hotkey is lagging, proly havent heard of betatesting

When I purchased TN it said it will come with free updates for life, NO?

Was gonna post the same thing

dear god, i payed for tn twice (both times i was pretty sure i payed for lifetime subscription/support), the first time my code stopped working after a year and it asked me to pay again

the day that TN1 stops working on pokerstars i will not upgrade. All i am using right now is autotimebank and clicking couple popups, basic and FREE ahk script will do that for me. kthxbye

Table Ninja was an original piece of software when it was initially released. Nowadays, Stars has integrated the majority of the once-innovative ideas, to the point that it's far from the necessity that it once was.

$20 a month! You've got to be f*cking joking!

^Same here. Now that Stars provides most of the options, one or two free scripts are all that are needed these days.

Complete thievery with that pricing structure... What happened to your original terms of service? You never mentioned pricing changes due to the need to update your software that likely really takes an hour or three by a computer whiz which I am sure you already are or at least employ...

No way I can afford to use your product at the micros...

More realistic is $10 or $5 for pro and lite versions, $50 for the year.

Thats still pricey but at least its not like you are saying "FU, pay me what I want or you are cut off".

Thats what I felt like after reading your email and responses in this thread Table Ninja to be quite honest with you...

I thought I PAID for my copy already!

Unbelieviable,

NO WAY

The email I got was from Holdem Manager, doesn't Taylor Caby own HEM? The dude's super smart but never did I think he'd make such a dumb business decision. Yes, he underpriced CR when it first came out but this TN subscription is complete BS!

I purchased TN and TNFT, I don't even play that many tables. Hardly need the product. Give me my money back, I paid the money thinking that I purchased this product to work for life.

So wait...

I get a refund if I bought TN1 after Feb. 15th but damn it, I bought it on Feb. 5th this year... So I paid 60$ for a lifetime support... Now what? No refund possible?

Paying a subscription, fine, but that much? I only use it to move tables out of my center stack and the Auto bet amount for Flop/Turn/River (which Pokerstars already supports...)

So 120$ per year for moving tables? And that's limited to 8 tables... Can anyone direct me to a little AHK for that, please? Thanks!

And yes, I will NOT pay for TN2 after I just bought TN1 for life... (And I don't even own a credit card... weired EuroDonk, I know...)

Just another disgruntled customer...

$20/month? No chance. You've lost my business for TableNinja and I'll probably jump from HoldemManager when I'm next in the market for HUD/tracking software.

I would seriously reconsider this action as poker players have long, long memories. You may think you can justify the subscription model because you have a short update cycle but, from software dev to software dev, you can't. This is just a money-grab - you should thoroughly expect to have to update and support your software when you make it.

Also:

Completely disgusting customer service. To 100% turn your back on existing customers and force them to upgrade to a far more expensive model is ridiculous. Particular when you guarantee updates for life. Also please stop quoting the exact same bs in relation to everyone's posts and grow some balls and answer people properly. Your attempting to rip off a lot of people here at least have some dignity and try and understand where they are coming from and provide reasonable responses.

Also this.

Hi,

I am sorry to hear you are having problems with TN2 i have tested TN2 and was able to use these features can you please do the following

Reprodocue the issue > go to TN2 setup tab > click on send logs to Table Ninja

This will then create a zipped file will all your settings and log files please attache this zipped file to an email and send it to support@tableninja.com and we will look over them for errors.

Aslo if you have UAC enabled can you please disable it and see if this solves the issue.

Also have you seen the setup guide for TN2 please be sure to double check you have everything setup correctly http://hm2faq.holdemmanager.com/ques...etup+%28TN2%29

Thanks

Hello to poker community!

I am amateur in this world, and i want to say a few words about my feelings about what is happening here and i believe someone will listen.

I purchased TN 1 month ago. Because of autoregistering feature, so i can play 12 tables smoothly on PS. Everything till today was fine. Only thing i was wondering about, is why such good tool is for one time payment, and i knew that it will not continue forever.

And here it is: TN 2, a bit optimised, a bit updated, but as i thought - only available for monthly/yearly subscription. Thats fine, no problem in subscriptions, acceptable move from TN developers.

BUT... actually i don't want to repeat (a lot is said in previous posts), but if i will, it is because someone is not listening carefully.

DO YOU THINK IT IS FAIR TO PUT "8" TABLE MAX ON STANDART PACK?

Where did you get this mistical number "8" ? Why not 9 or 12? Because you KNOW, that normal multitabling starts after 9/12 tables... and don't tell me that you don't....

It is so easy to see how you care about amateurs, and i am the one, yes.

I play on 12 tables 3,5 $ and i calculated, that my ROI because of TN will drop down 1%. This calculation is based on TN 2 PRO plan at 150.$ a year subscription - no other choices for multi tablers are given! I can find a lot of poker tool developers who think about micro/low stake players, and reduce price, BUT NOT ABILITIES TO WORK !!! Your new strategy is totally wrong and not long success based.

Also i have found this - if i want to upgrade to yearly subscription PRO - 150.$/year, there is NO 3 MONTHS FREE! What is this? If i purchased month ago, then i must ask to refund money, right? But in your new policy is said to ask for refund ONLY if i don't want to use TN2, explain this? So u want me to let you keep my 60.$ allready paid month ago and + 150.$ for new TN2 ? Something is not clear here...

Personally i will use TN1 until end of support (Aug 2013), and later i will see if something is changed in your new package policy, if not, there will be a lot of solutions around here, and i am 100% sure about this, competitors never sleep...


And 150.$ a year i believe is fine for mid to high stake players, they will not feel that big attack to bankroll as i do feel.

Do you really think that this is well calculated farsighted +EV move?

And i will repeat again, amateurs (read micro/low stake grinders) CAN'T AFFORD IT. If i were a PRO, i was not here and complaining about anything.

And now answer, how do you think, how many customers here are PRO and how many amateurs?

Do you strongly believe that amateurs will blindly continue to pay 150.$ a year! for a few extras that are not available anywhere else? Yes? Ok! Then your business is on a BIG BIG DOWNSWING!

I will not count, but there is a service named Google, and there is a lot of answers for strangers like me, where to find 90% of your offered features for free/minimal one time payments.

I strongly believe, that one day TableNinja will come to this conclusion with or without economical pressure, but question is: WHY NOT TO DO IT NOW and leave customers where they are !?!

Thank you for your attention if given.

EDX

Hi,

What site is this happening on? Is it just one specific site or all sites?

I have tested your issue on all 3 sites and the bet hotkey is working for me and getting no lag using the increment hotkey.

Can you please do the following Reproduce the issues > go to the settings tab in TN2 > click on send logs to TableNinja

Once you do this is will create a zipped file containing your logs and settings please attach this to an email and send it to support@holdemmanager.com and we will look over them for any errors.

Thanks

Hi,

Hi, regarding the issues on the pricing as previously explained we felt a subscription option was the best option so that we can develop a high quality product that everyone deserves. I wont re-quote my post from earlier but in a nutshell the work involved to continue to add the features that everyone wants and to continue to fix bugs caused by site issues in a timely manner has high costs involved.

Our goal is to bring you the best product we can and a subscription model is beneficial because if we are to stay competitive we have to continue to be innovative and provide new features to make sure our customers stay with us.

We do however appreciate the feedback you give as valued customers even if it is negative and understand your concerns that price is also a deciding factor and that some people only use the software for limited purposes and are playing micro stakes and for those players this might not be value.

Management will make a response on that issue today, please keep in mind that it is early morning US so it will be a couple of hours away but i can assure you we will respond as soon as possible on the matter.

Thanks

so are you just going to ignore this question ???

ANY REASONABLE ANSWER FROM TN ?

If it's the same answer as you just gave tell them not to bother, you'll just piss more people off. Something will actually have to change if you don't want a significant portion of your userbase to up-and-leave.