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NL100 KK HU NL100 KK HU

11-03-2009 , 10:12 PM
Hi,

I've just started the table, very first hand. Villian is unknown.
Probably a bigger 4bet would have been better, but I like to keep my 4bets smallish for balancing reasons and I also had position. At this time I didn't know if villian is competent or fishy.


Poker Stars $0.50/$1 No Limit Hold'em - 2 players
The Official 2+2 Hand Converter Powered By DeucesCracked.com

Hero (BTN/SB): $100.00
BB: $100.00

Pre Flop: ($1.50) Hero is BTN/SB with K K
Hero raises to $3, BB raises to $9, Hero raises to $21, BB calls $12

Flop: ($42.00) 2 A Q (2 players)
BB bets $27, Hero ???


I don't think calling is an option, but can we profitably push here?

Last edited by Goertsy; 11-03-2009 at 10:19 PM.
11-03-2009 , 10:41 PM
calling is better than folding, but i'd just shove
11-03-2009 , 10:52 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by LIONHEARTFF8
calling is better than folding, but i'd just shove
What range do you assign to villian?
11-03-2009 , 11:00 PM
blergh first hand vs unknown hu with this action id always end up shovign
11-03-2009 , 11:01 PM
forget range. you are betting 79 to win 59. you have about 30% equity when called. so,
you need to fold him out some x percent of the time when you win,

x(59)+(1-x)(-79+30%200)
x59 + (1-x)(-19)
x(78)-19
x>19/78>24%. Do you really think he folds 24% of the time???????? ffs. snap fold. if you think you have more than 30% equity when called, nice try!! and also you think he lead folding or lead calling JJ:x:, no way.

insta muck.
11-03-2009 , 11:10 PM
yeah i dont think you have fold equity, prob a fold here.
11-03-2009 , 11:20 PM
What's up with all these folds, I shove it in his face
11-03-2009 , 11:34 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by -VINNY-
What's up with all these folds, I shove it in his face
bingoooo


but OP, HU forum is better for this
11-04-2009 , 03:49 PM
Ok guys, thanks for the replies.

Here is the result. My thinking process was like:

Oh, ****. I think I should fold... yeah, I should fold here... fold, fold ... Crap, I can't fold this! F u I shove!


Poker Stars $0.50/$1 No Limit Hold'em - 2 players
The Official 2+2 Hand Converter Powered By DeucesCracked.com

Hero (BTN/SB): $100.00
BB: $100.00

Pre Flop: ($1.50) Hero is BTN/SB with K K
Hero raises to $3, BB raises to $9, Hero raises to $21, BB calls $12

Flop: ($42.00) 2 A Q (2 players)
BB bets $27, Hero raises to $79 all in, BB folds

Final Pot: $96.00
Hero wins $95.00
(Rake: $1.00)
11-04-2009 , 03:55 PM
LOL. How could this ever be a fold? We have 40% equity pretty much every time we have the worst hand. This is already enough. If we ever have the best hand, that's just an added bonus.
11-04-2009 , 03:55 PM
Think the shove was fine. Don't really like a fold.
11-04-2009 , 04:04 PM
Ok, thx.
Now I'm confident that the shove was ok.
11-04-2009 , 04:25 PM
LOOOL I recognize that thought process in most of my own shoves, especially the F U part hehehe.

FWIW after the fact, I would aslo shove here bc this is very often some kind of feeler bet / bluff ("lol he totally has KK JJ TT 99 88 etc after 4-betting and is so folding if I bet out on this flop because it scared the crap out of him, hope he isn't spewy enough to push if he has a spade ok here we gogogo")
11-04-2009 , 04:33 PM
@llrrss: You're right that his donk lead looks ******ed, but I hope you understand that it doesn't matter if he's never folding to a shove. If he flips AQ or AcJs face up, going all-in is still +EV.
11-04-2009 , 04:34 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by -VINNY-
What's up with all these folds, I shove it in his face
cuz **** this guy, right?
11-04-2009 , 05:15 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by hurt
cuz **** this guy, right?
cuz we get folds and callsby queens with a spade, pockets with a spade etc....


and **** that guy, cause you know he is insta quitting if you fold

Last edited by Fishpocalypse; 11-04-2009 at 05:16 PM. Reason: **** that guy
11-04-2009 , 06:05 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by zugzwangg
forget range. you are betting 79 to win 59. you have about 30% equity when called. so,
you need to fold him out some x percent of the time when you win,

x(59)+(1-x)(-79+30%200)
x59 + (1-x)(-19)
x(78)-19
x>19/78>24%. Do you really think he folds 24% of the time???????? ffs. snap fold. if you think you have more than 30% equity when called, nice try!! and also you think he lead folding or lead calling JJ:x:, no way.

insta muck.
The pot is $69 after villain bets, not $59.

You have way more than 30% equity when called. You have 38.5% equity against an LOLTIGHT range of AA/QQ/22, AQs, AQo, AxJs.

.385(200) = $77 EV when called. He has to fold > 3% of the time for this to be profitable. (.03)(69) = $2.07.

Snap-shove.
11-04-2009 , 08:27 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by hurt
cuz **** this guy, right?
lol pretty much, spades, two K's, and back door str8's, along with the million snap folds you'll get when he has garbage

but **** this guy is spot on!
11-04-2009 , 08:35 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by zugzwangg
forget range. you are betting 79 to win 59. you have about 30% equity when called. so,
you need to fold him out some x percent of the time when you win,

x(59)+(1-x)(-79+30%200)
x59 + (1-x)(-19)
x(78)-19
x>19/78>24%. Do you really think he folds 24% of the time???????? ffs. snap fold. if you think you have more than 30% equity when called, nice try!! and also you think he lead folding or lead calling JJ:x:, no way.

insta muck.
Stop posting strat until you know what you're doing.
11-04-2009 , 08:59 PM
So what's wrong with calling?

He's either close to drawing dead or we're drawing to the flush. So I don't get how shoving can be more profitable than calling.
11-04-2009 , 09:04 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by realsheesha
So what's wrong with calling?

He's either close to drawing dead or we're drawing to the flush. So I don't get how shoving can be more profitable than calling.
If we hit our flush its harder to get paid if we just call here.

      
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