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WSOPc Caesars - 0 FT bubble, is this where we squeeze it all in? WSOPc Caesars - 0 FT bubble, is this where we squeeze it all in?

01-25-2012 , 09:19 PM
I'm probably 10/11 with about 100k at 3k-6k-500a. 10th will pay about $1,900 with $26k going to first. UTG is an older gentleman (50s) from New Mexico with about 35 bbs and has appeared to play a straightforward ABC game. Button is younger dude with about 40 bbs who plays a creative, aggressive game and has an impressive resume of cashes. Hero and his 16 bbs are in small blind.

Older gentleman opens to 16k from utg. Button flats. Hero looks down at Ah5h and wants to squeeze-pile, but has to consider what the older guy is opening utg and whether he has fold equity. What to do, wise ones?
01-25-2012 , 09:26 PM
FYI, we were 6-handed at the time this played out.
01-25-2012 , 09:54 PM
Who's the kid? Piling can't be bad.
01-25-2012 , 10:20 PM
Old guy open utg hmm kinda close but I prefer open shove with my stack size coz I dont like being called with A5 with dominated aces and it doesnt do that well vs 66+,AJo+
01-25-2012 , 10:30 PM
i dont agree that squeezing is good here ... people tend to tighten up their opening ranges on ft bubbles of live events ... esp older/straightforward/ABC players... so u have to plan on getting called by utg a lot of the time and also take into consideration that the button may be trapping. and A5 plays terribly against their calling ranges.
01-25-2012 , 11:14 PM
thought is good just not a good hand to do it w
01-26-2012 , 09:25 AM
Trivial fold given UTG read. Sometimes a squeeze is just a squeeze. I'd have to be pretty sure that the older ABC-UTG could lay down AJ/AQ before trying.

BTW 16K seems like a larger than usual open. Was that his standard?
01-26-2012 , 11:01 AM
OP you need to learn what "squeeze on the final table bubble" entails... it means doing it with an equal or bigger stack against someone who's possibly weak and can fold... not using a stack that is less than half of his when he opens UTG, with an easily dominated hand against a lot of his opening range that would call given stacksizes.

Also don't know why you consider a young player who flats to be "creative and aggressive", but I guess he's not that important unless he's been raising entire time and suddenly decided to flat which could set off an alarm bell or two also.
01-26-2012 , 07:20 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Beachman42
Trivial fold given UTG read. Sometimes a squeeze is just a squeeze. I'd have to be pretty sure that the older ABC-UTG could lay down AJ/AQ before trying.

BTW 16K seems like a larger than usual open. Was that his standard?
Well, this was actually smaller than he had opened some hands at earlier levels. He had been opening 3 to 3.5x the night before. Other older dude typically opened 4 to 4.5x even this deep into tournament. Most others were 2x to 2.2x, but not the older fellas
01-27-2012 , 01:37 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by 663366
OP you need to learn what "squeeze on the final table bubble" entails... it means doing it with an equal or bigger stack against someone who's possibly weak and can fold...
ohhhh okay
01-28-2012 , 03:13 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by 663366
OP you need to learn what "squeeze on the final table bubble" entails... it means doing it with an equal or bigger stack against someone who's possibly weak and can fold... not using a stack that is less than half of his when he opens UTG, with an easily dominated hand against a lot of his opening range that would call given stacksizes.
Oh thanks I always thought squeezing on the final table bubble meant taking a squeeze spot that happened to be on the final table bubble. I'll be sure to note stack sizes next time I consider calling this play a squeeze.

Also, I think people itt are giving live players too much credit. If they can find a reason to fold, they will. It doesn't matter if his opening range is something like AT+,88+ or something utg when 6handed and he should call all of it. He'll just rationalize to himself that he is probably flipping or dominated with most of his range and make a pretty loltight fold, especially with another player to act behind (listen to some of them talk every once in a while after hands exactly like this and they will either say this very same thing to someone around them or even to you directly). He might even be opening wider than you think giving you even more fe than you expect sometimes. I've seen people make these folds when they shouldn't at least 5 times with hands as strong as QQ in just the past week at the BWO, including a final table.

I'd be more worried about the young guy who is obviously more likely to be playing his ranges more appropriately and flats here if all the stacks left behind him are good for reshoving and he thinks any of you are capable of ripping it light here.
01-28-2012 , 06:22 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by 663366
OP you need to learn what "squeeze on the final table bubble" entails... it means doing it with an equal or bigger stack against someone who's possibly weak and can fold... not using a stack that is less than half of his when he opens UTG, with an easily dominated hand against a lot of his opening range that would call given stacksizes.

Also don't know why you consider a young player who flats to be "creative and aggressive", but I guess he's not that important unless he's been raising entire time and suddenly decided to flat which could set off an alarm bell or two also.
pretty sure you are the one that needs to "learn what squeezing on the final table bubble entails"
01-28-2012 , 06:39 PM
press fold. younger kid is gonna sighcall you with hands that crush you way too often, utg raiser might be dumb and call you with a lot of hands that crush you since he might not be aware that bt can make his life hard since he interprets bt flat as not that strong of a hand.

You can find way better spots to resteal, open jam, minraise and play pots, limp buttons and beat up ppl postflop, etc.
01-28-2012 , 06:43 PM
I would fold here, find another spot that would be more optimal.
01-29-2012 , 01:08 AM
OR probably has a good hand, usually 77+/AT+/KQ. BTN could be calling with position pretty light, could have a strong hand that isn't strong enough to 3-bet call with against an ep raise from a tight player, or could be trapping with a big pair.

You are about a 2-1 dog against the range that OR calls or 4-bets with. OR might fold the lower part of his range because the squeeze puts him in a difficult situation since BTN could have a big hand or could give him trouble if he flats and you shouldn't be light here. In that case, BTN is getting 1.8-1 and will call unless he was making a very light call preflop with position.

In live tournament, there are usually a lot of people who like to flat call raises, so you can squeeze over top of 4 people or whatever for 25xBB or whatever. This isn't a good squeeze situation.
01-30-2012 , 07:50 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by GoldenBears
press fold. younger kid is gonna sighcall you with hands that crush you way too often,
Think this was spot-on.

So here's the results, and explanation of why I posted this.

OP folded. The hand went to showdown and utg tabled K9ss. Button flat had ATo. Made me wonder if I missed a spot.

But also think if I had jammed, younger kid just might have sigh-called with ATo, just as GoldenBears said. The day before I had 3b jammed on him twice and he tank-folded unhappily both times.

After I busted this event in 9th, I mentioned this hand to a young LAG internet kid I know and he said it was a snap-shove. Made me wonder if I had missed a spot to chip up. Thanks for input everyone.
01-30-2012 , 08:10 PM
Doubt he's folding at, and also the fact that hands like at are in his flatting range makes a jam even worse.

Good fold, gg

      
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