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super annoying wtf 1k spot against sheets super annoying wtf 1k spot against sheets

04-11-2011 , 09:52 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tournament Life
In that case I suppose you don't have a 3betting range?
im sure he's super dying for you to teach him
04-11-2011 , 10:08 PM
I was just asking some questions. It's not my fault he answered it with a ridiculous pokerstove.
04-11-2011 , 10:24 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tournament Life
I was just asking some questions. It's not my fault he answered it with a ridiculous pokerstove.
[ ] ridiculous
04-11-2011 , 10:31 PM
Tournament life - you're right, it's probably not optimal overall. There are various reasons why playing suboptimally might be fine though, I guess.
04-11-2011 , 10:50 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tournament Life
@OP: Can you explain why flatting>>>>>3betting PF?

then you might want to change up your PF game a tad. I could be wrong.
doesn't sound like a question
04-11-2011 , 11:16 PM
I don't mind flatting pre, but I'd be more likely to do it because there's two stacks behind that are being given a tempting jam spot instead of feeling like it's a bad get in. I think that considering how many small 3 bet-4 bet wars regs get in with each other these days keeping AK in our 3-bet range just has to be right at these stacks in most scenarios in position vs a reg, even a tighter one.
04-11-2011 , 11:30 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bond18
I don't mind flatting pre, but I'd be more likely to do it because there's two stacks behind that are being given a tempting jam spot instead of feeling like it's a bad get in. I think that considering how many small 3 bet-4 bet wars regs get in with each other these days keeping AK in our 3-bet range just has to be right at these stacks in most scenarios in position vs a reg, even a tighter one.
everyone i spoke to thought the flat was optimal and that was before they knew 2 squeeze stacks behind! I still think it is but if you all wanna argue and beat a dead horse into the ground the rest of the way, be my guest. I'd like to think even against a good player like sheets I could play this hand pretty profitably in position against him.
04-12-2011 , 12:17 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by isuxatpokerbad
everyone i spoke to thought the flat was optimal and that was before they knew 2 squeeze stacks behind! I still think it is but if you all wanna argue and beat a dead horse into the ground the rest of the way, be my guest. I'd like to think even against a good player like sheets I could play this hand pretty profitably in position against him.
I don't think anyone on here said/would say that flatting isn't profitable.
04-12-2011 , 01:54 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vekked
I don't think anyone on here said/would say that flatting isn't profitable.
ok but you're missing out on the word "optimal" which actually came in the first sentence of my post. We have a really good hand and afaik I don't suck postflop so I'm assuming that whatever way I play the hand will be profitable, whether i 3bet or I flat.
04-12-2011 , 02:10 AM
isuxatpokerbad

why do you have to be such an arrogant prick to everyone? maybe you dont mean to, but you come off as a super huge arrogant douche in every thread you post in.

preflop is not "easy", and it's certainly debatable. posting arrogant/sarcastic things to people who are trying to help you (and themselves) is far from necessary. we get it, you think youre really awesome at poker (idk ive never played vs you, probably are good)- but if you're so good that you can talk down to smart/helpful posters..why post the thread in the first place?

i would 3b pre with my normal image, but with your perceived image of sheets and yourself i can certainly see flatting being best.

one thing i think you are missing/underrating:

-sn's aren't mentioned in OP but, its possible that sheets has no idea who you are on UB (or at all) and therefore perceives you as a UB random/clown. Which means you can probably make it like 4k and sheets will flat/"get out of line" wider than you think and make 3 betting better

as played i honestly don't know what i'd do. its probably one of those spots where i'm looking at it and say fold but in the moment im just like lol and call like an idiot

nice laydown

Last edited by GeoffRas22; 04-12-2011 at 02:16 AM.
04-12-2011 , 02:53 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by isuxatpokerbad
ok but you're missing out on the word "optimal" which actually came in the first sentence of my post. We have a really good hand and afaik I don't suck postflop so I'm assuming that whatever way I play the hand will be profitable, whether i 3bet or I flat.
This is the part I was referring to in the last post too when you said "I'd like to think even against a good player like sheets I could play this hand pretty profitably in position against him.".

OBV you can/should be able to play AK profitable regardless of how you play it by virtue of it being ahead of villain's opening range and you have position, doubt anyone said that there was an unprofitable way to play it. Clearly a bunch of people think that for various reasons, best summarized by Bond, that flatting might not be optimal. For various reasons, best summarized by Geoffras, you seem to be taking most replies personally.
04-12-2011 , 04:27 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by isuxatpokerbad
[ ] ridiculous
It's not ridiculous, just pretty unimportant. 3-bet/folding is a fine option here.
04-12-2011 , 12:23 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by GeoffRas22
isuxatpokerbad

why do you have to be such an arrogant prick to everyone? maybe you dont mean to, but you come off as a super huge arrogant douche in every thread you post in.
+1
04-12-2011 , 01:12 PM
The hh Sheets posted shows all the screen names and since OP has a similar name across other sites Sheets may know that he isn't a random. Pretty cool hand and I'd call in game because I'm bad but I think folding river is best.

OP comes off as acerbic for sure, but he's not a bad dude904, just young and angsty. Eventually he'll learn that there are benefits to being polite more often than not.
04-12-2011 , 01:15 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by sheetsworld
DARRENELIAS - Folds (Preselection)
does this mean he clicked auto fold? Seems like something that shouldn't be in the HH if so.
04-12-2011 , 02:09 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by GeoffRas22
isuxatpokerbad

why do you have to be such an arrogant prick to everyone? maybe you dont mean to, but you come off as a super huge arrogant douche in every thread you post in.

preflop is not "easy", and it's certainly debatable. posting arrogant/sarcastic things to people who are trying to help you (and themselves) is far from necessary. we get it, you think youre really awesome at poker (idk ive never played vs you, probably are good)- but if you're so good that you can talk down to smart/helpful posters..why post the thread in the first place?

i would 3b pre with my normal image, but with your perceived image of sheets and yourself i can certainly see flatting being best.

one thing i think you are missing/underrating:

-sn's aren't mentioned in OP but, its possible that sheets has no idea who you are on UB (or at all) and therefore perceives you as a UB random/clown. Which means you can probably make it like 4k and sheets will flat/"get out of line" wider than you think and make 3 betting better

as played i honestly don't know what i'd do. its probably one of those spots where i'm looking at it and say fold but in the moment im just like lol and call like an idiot

nice laydown
We have quite a bit of hands on each other if he reads a hud at all, most of them being on UB, so during the hand I absolutely think he knows that I'm at least a regular. As for coming off as a prick, be done, I'm giving my advice and sometimes people say stupid stuff that isn't related. Seriously, the 3bet pre argument compared to flatting is going to be beating a dead horse and a ton of people are going to say 3bet and others are going to say flat; I really don't care and I don't really think I can defend myself much better than I (and you) have already have, and I'm really not worried about pre. I got all I needed out of the thread already and trust me I do 3bet there in certain spots versus certain opponents but 60 bigs deep against a sheets ep raise when both of us have been pretty tight isn't out one of them and quite frankly I don't really think it's too close, but I do understand that ace king is a really strong hand and alot of the time I do like to pile in money against people.

Quote:
Originally Posted by NeverScaredB
It's not ridiculous, just pretty unimportant. 3-bet/folding is a fine option here.
Crossed my mind but I don't know sheets' hooding tendencies in this spot and if they aren't very frequent then it defeats the purpose.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dantes
does this mean he clicked auto fold? Seems like something that shouldn't be in the HH if so.
I don't really know. It said I timed out at the end of the hand history, which I didn't do. I just went into the timebank.
04-12-2011 , 03:08 PM
Pre is fine.

Flop betsizing sucks, check or bet what you would bet with a pp.

Turn is fine.

Call river. Your line doesn't make sense, you can't have AK and he can, therefore he should have a lot of air too.
04-12-2011 , 03:25 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by MaverickUSC
you can't have AK and he can,
I'd like to respectfully disagree. :-P

Do you have any input on my HH question?
04-12-2011 , 06:37 PM
AKs is a much better flatting hand because you want flush draws multi-way but flatting with AKo has to be part of your aresenal...there may be an optimal flatting %, i'm not really sure, but the benefits of flatting are not shutting out hands you dominate, like KJ and other aces when u have position, it's going to be massively profitable depending on the types of hands your opps like to raise

the benefits of re-raising is to isolate since Ace/king high is going to be good on the flop much more often vs one opp than 3 or 4, and you can force pairs to flip with you, depending on stack sizes...the deeper you are the more i like flatting for value, the shallower u are the more i like isoing

      
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