Help with a hand from 2k WSOP - High Stakes MTT Strategy

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Help with a hand from 2k WSOP

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06-19-2008 , 06:16 AM

ImaLucSac

journeyman

Join Date: Feb 2008 Posts: 266

Blinds are 400/800/50 I am relatively new to this table, but have made a few preflop raises. No one has faced me down or rr me as of yet. I have about 25k in chips. Villain covers

I open the c/o to 2100 with KK. A relatively active older gentleman calls fairly quickly from the sb. This guy has been limp callin from early-early mid position a couple times since I have been here. Flop comes K105 2clubs. He checks, I make a cbet of 2800, which he calls fairly fast. Turn is K. He leads into me for 6k. I think for a few and call. River 10 club. He checks, I?

Thoughts on streets, esp river.

06-19-2008 , 07:05 AM

registrar

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Jan 2005 Posts: 6,886

Bet 6k.

06-19-2008 , 07:54 AM

shutEMdown

veteran

Join Date: Nov 2007 Posts: 2,843

I quickly prevent the temptation of laying my nuts on his chin and since pot=23500 with 14100 behind i prob just shove since it looks weaker than a tiny bet and hes not calling any amount unless hes got Tx so u might as well go for max value.

06-19-2008 , 09:54 AM

registrar

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Jan 2005 Posts: 6,886

He'll shove quads.

He'll call a small bet way more than twice as often as he'll call a shove with a flush, the small boat or AA.

I think the value is definitely in betting small.

06-19-2008 , 10:23 AM

shutEMdown

veteran

Join Date: Nov 2007 Posts: 2,843

not so sure registar. its the type of board where they either call or not regardless of amount. the quick call on flop indicates some kind of draw but he wouldnt lead out paired turn. I think clubs draws lead flop more often than c/c from OP description of villian. I dont think he c/c flop lead turn with club draw. and no way its AA cuz older doods min 3bet that a ton pre. my only prob is that if he does have Tx wouldnt he lead river?

06-19-2008 , 05:10 PM

jnelson214

grinder

Join Date: Mar 2008 Posts: 503

Can we ever raise villians Lead on the Turn? Would this help disguise or give up that we have atleast one k in our hand?

But I do agree with Registar that smaller value bets will be called more than a large shove.

06-19-2008 , 05:12 PM

charder30

formerly known as zj123

Join Date: Oct 2006 Posts: 27,428

Quote:

Originally Posted by shutEMdown

pot=23500 with 14100 behind

im beting like 13500. lol live players.

06-19-2008 , 09:33 PM

Todd Terry

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Apr 2006 Posts: 16,301

How many I made quads at the WSOP threads have we had in the last week? I've flopped 1 set in 2 weeks ffs.

I think I agree with registrar, an old guy will call 6K but fold to a shove with a T here.

06-20-2008 , 12:05 AM

mkind0516

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Aug 2006 Posts: 6,267

Quote:

Originally Posted by ZJ123

im beting like 13500. lol live players.

how legendary

06-20-2008 , 01:07 AM

#10

ImaLucSac

journeyman

Join Date: Feb 2008 Posts: 266

Well, I did shove. Guy tanked for a good 3 minutes before folding. I chose to shove because I thought it looked more bluffy from me. Seems to me like the fields at the Rio have been paying off overbets a lot. It being more than half his remaing stack could be an argument over a vb.

Now that I think about it 8k or so prob gets paid more. As registrar said.

Last edited by ImaLucSac; 06-20-2008 at 01:10 AM. Reason: kudos

06-20-2008 , 01:47 AM

#11

AGame18

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Apr 2007 Posts: 7,838

check back

06-20-2008 , 02:40 AM

#12

pfkaok

veteran

Join Date: May 2004 Posts: 3,029

Quote:

Originally Posted by ImaLucSac

I stongly consider minraising turn here... it looks fishy, but live players will probably not be able to get away from anything to that bet, and they might "take a stand" by shoving in w/ a T, or AA, or somehting funny.

06-20-2008 , 04:40 AM

#13

Bakes

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Oct 2005 Posts: 15,981

10k is clearly the best. DUCY?

06-20-2008 , 05:34 AM

#14

Bond18

banned

Join Date: Nov 2003 Posts: 10,633

Quote:

Originally Posted by pfkaok

Depends what kind of old guy it is. If he can't big off a big hand out of spite, I like this. If he'll see monsters under the bed because the top card paired, then I don't. If you think he might fold turn to raise then calling and betting some lame about of 6-10000 may be best. Live players fold to shoves too much and this is something I need to start doing myself because I miss value.

06-20-2008 , 06:29 PM

#15

pfkaok

veteran

Join Date: May 2004 Posts: 3,029

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bond18

Yeah... this spot is interesting b/c it totally does depend on what type of old guy he is. But failing any read, I think that against the spectrum of old guys, you can make the minraise, and expect him to see monsters, but still not be able to fold b/c its a min bet. Then you can make some stupid small bet again on the river for like 5-6k. Most of the time he'll "know" you have a big hand, but can't resist the odds on the off chance that you're some stupid internet kid who just makes weird random small bets and raises on bluffs.

06-21-2008 , 03:05 AM

#16

IWEARGOGGLES

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Mar 2005 Posts: 7,352

The biggest bet that is the least amount of chips?

06-21-2008 , 04:33 AM

#17

Clayton

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Oct 2004 Posts: 32,236

goddam, Luke beat me to it, and I was so proud of my super-awesome live developmental skillz. I was gonna say throw a 5k chip in if you had one, otherwise bet 5k in yellows.

Either way I think 5k is best, people made ridic folds to a shove that they would instacall 5k with

06-21-2008 , 04:37 AM

#18

Bakes

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Oct 2005 Posts: 15,981

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bakes

10k is clearly the best. DUCY?

actually i beat both of y'all -_-

06-21-2008 , 04:59 AM

#19

flyingmoose

veteran

Join Date: Jan 2005 Posts: 2,224

It's been said already, but add me to the camp that likes 5-6k.

06-21-2008 , 06:53 AM

#20

Howard Treesong

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Oct 2004 Posts: 13,738

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bakes

10k is clearly the best. DUCY?

No. Please explain in your usual style.

06-21-2008 , 01:33 PM

#21

Bakes

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Oct 2005 Posts: 15,981

2 chips

06-21-2008 , 01:43 PM

#22

Todd Terry

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Join Date: Apr 2006 Posts: 16,301

^^ There wouldn't be any 5K chips in play at this point, too early.

06-21-2008 , 02:06 PM

#23

Bakes

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Oct 2005 Posts: 15,981

ahh missed it was a 2k. right on. i still like 10k tho cuz you prob have like 100 ante chips and ****, gon make your stack look big

06-21-2008 , 03:16 PM

#24

PoorSkillz

old hand

Join Date: Oct 2007 Posts: 1,447

Here I thought 10K bet was because board was filled with 10's and K's.

06-21-2008 , 03:51 PM

#25

mattg1983

journeyman

Join Date: Jun 2006 Posts: 327

Quote:

Originally Posted by ImaLucSac

Now that I think about it 8k or so prob gets paid more. As registrar said.

It may get paid a litle bit more... but you will make more money by shoving, since the bet size wont effect his call frequency THAT much IMO

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