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FTOPS #1, pair and oesfd on turn FTOPS #1, pair and oesfd on turn

02-11-2010 , 02:16 AM
Villain- tag, straight forward to this point, havent seen him take any weird lines. Table has been passive all around except for 2 exceptions (not villain).
I feel hand is straight forward till the turn. Two choices, push or check behind. Thoughts? I have just over pot size bet on turn.


Full Tilt Poker FTOPS Event #1 No Limit Hold'em Tournament - t170/t340 Blinds + t25 - 9 players
The Official 2+2 Hand Converter Powered By DeucesCracked.com

SB: t10815 M = 14.71
BB: t16278 M = 22.15
UTG: t5751 M = 7.82
Hero (UTG+1): t7383 M = 10.04
UTG+2: t11519 M = 15.67
MP1: t10099 M = 13.74
MP2: t6201 M = 8.44
CO: t6858 M = 9.33
BTN: t5365 M = 7.30

Pre Flop: (t735) Hero is UTG+1 with 7 7
1 fold, Hero raises to t720, 6 folds, BB calls t380

Flop: (t1835) 9 6 A (2 players)
BB checks, Hero bets t1175, BB requests TIME, BB calls t1175

Turn: (t4185) 8 (2 players)
BB requests TIME, BB checks, hero?
02-11-2010 , 02:23 AM
check, what hands are u hoping he folds if u push?
02-11-2010 , 04:06 AM
I like a jam but I'd check the flop a lot.
02-11-2010 , 09:29 AM
Easy check imo, hes calling you with all A's and his flush and i dont see alot more that he could have.

I think the flop is an easy bet, why do you want to check behind ncb?
02-11-2010 , 09:45 AM
pajama jam
02-11-2010 , 02:33 PM
i check the flop but jamming or checking is fine i prolly check back turn given line..
02-11-2010 , 02:57 PM
betting and checking flop are both fine, I'd jam most of the time here
02-11-2010 , 03:46 PM
Flop, whatever, pool or pond. I don't get jamming the turn at all.
02-11-2010 , 05:07 PM
agree with funkii
02-11-2010 , 05:13 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Todd Terry
Flop, whatever, pool or pond. I don't get jamming the turn at all.
he'll fold better sometimes me thinks.
02-11-2010 , 05:17 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mench
he'll fold better sometimes me thinks.
Possibly, but I don't think it's too often. And we have decent equity if we check behind against those better hands that could fold here.
02-11-2010 , 05:20 PM
I'm with Todd. Don't really understand jamming the turn. We have good equity and the better hands that we can get him to fold to a turn jam will also fold to a half pot river bet.
02-11-2010 , 10:25 PM
I'm definitely in the check turn camp.
02-11-2010 , 11:17 PM
what??? BB has to fold any Ax/pair plus straight draw/straight draw range that is out there. If we had AA and wanted to shove for value here, theres no way people would be saying "yeah this is cool, they never fold 2nd pair to a barrell so just shove it in"

i think people dont appreciate how wide people are peeling preflop when the raiser makes it barely a minraise... it lays them over 3/1 and they cant help peeling with such a wide range.

its a ftops tourney... people get excited about ftops for a reason!
02-11-2010 , 11:21 PM
I'm just guessing here but I dont think there's much of an equity difference (which I guess would mean you should check for tournament life), but yeah I think they will fold a lot and you dont need them to fold very often for it to be good
02-12-2010 , 04:26 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Todd Terry
Flop, whatever, pool or pond. I don't get jamming the turn at all.
This. Jamming makes our hand look alot like a turned flush draw and I don't see us having much fold equity versus an A.

edit - eh, we actually do make weak aces fold methinks. I still think I like jamming a set here more than I like jamming our draw.
02-12-2010 , 05:11 AM
the profitability of jamming sets for value and jamming 77 as a bluff arent mutually exclusive.

it's an easy value shove because the majority of his range is one pair, two pair and bottom set.

he "could" have a flush, but even most fish dont play like complete dullards by flatting preflop and then check/calling a flop bet with a flush draw when there's one pot sized bet behind.


you can shove the river for value with a set even if there's only a 30% chance he calls you (and a 70% chance that he folds) with top pair or two pair, as long as those hands represent a large enough fraction of his range.



i dont know if it's necessarily a spot that I'd bluff, but I would probably consider it if something struck me just right about the way he was playing.
02-12-2010 , 11:01 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Todd Terry
Possibly, but I don't think it's too often. And we have decent equity if we check behind against those better hands that could fold here.
+1 i dont think our oponent folds here a high % of the time. C and hope we catch something nice on the river.
02-12-2010 , 11:04 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by ekky
what??? BB has to fold any Ax/pair plus straight draw/straight draw range that is out there. If we had AA and wanted to shove for value here, theres no way people would be saying "yeah this is cool, they never fold 2nd pair to a barrell so just shove it in"

i think people dont appreciate how wide people are peeling preflop when the raiser makes it barely a minraise... it lays them over 3/1 and they cant help peeling with such a wide range.

its a ftops tourney... people get excited about ftops for a reason!
exacly, they get excited and do not fold their top pair no kicker. It is alot better to save our chips and value rape them when we have a hand. This looks like a hopeless bluff spot imo.

      
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