took ~3 years for both the ps2 and ps3 i think

So they will let you return the same one open box? I don't usually shop at best buy so idk how strict their return policy is for stuff like a ps4.

Also what would that mean for my game saves? I read that you could save your games to the cloud, so once I signed in on my psn account on the Groupon ps4 I'd get all my game saves, just would have to reinstall all my games hardware?

Depends where you are in the world - in the States Xbox is trailing somewhat to the PS4, but it's at least vaguely close. probably similar in the UK, rest of world Xbox is a write off for now. Being more expensive and having the worse version of almost every multi-platform game isn't doing the Xbox any favors, Sony PSN has improved considerably since last generation, and now also charges a monthly fee for access so the online playing field is technically quite even. I must admit after having been on xbox360 for the past 7 years or so, I find PSN certainly no worse than XBLG, maybe superior even - decent sales with extra discount, monthly free games (Xboxone will start this soon), no problem with joining games.

Not many games publish their stars afaik, but Battlefield 4 does - you can see current online player count here: http://bf4stats.com/

Right now it looks like below (prob a worst-case time of day for the US dominated xbox players, but I don't think I've ever seen PS4 without the highest player count)

Not sure about the game save part, but you can absolutely return the ps4 for a full refund within 14 days even after you've opened everything.

In the middle of moving house. Haven't even taken Watchdogs out of the Amazon package, and avoiding the thread like the plague. Such a sad panda.

On the flip side, I had a sliiiiightly better time on a track in Trials Fusion than dave. He said he was ~100th on the PS4 leaderboard, whereas my slightly better time was only 400th on the XB1 leaderboard. So it seems like XB1 gamers are better at games.

sick sample size

Hey man, just like the Battlefield 4 stats, we can only work with what we're given.

If it goes by the same timeline as the PS3, about 2 years from now.

can anybody with astros help out? i hooked my astros back up to my ps4 tonight after about a month and am 99% sure i did everything right. i have them hooked up to my pc as well like i always have and am watching the hockey game. my headset will pick up the game sound but when i mute the game and try to talk, even screaming into my headset it wont pick up any sound. i have no idea what on earth would cause this, any help?

2-3 years maybe? and it's slim enough, when a new slimmer design hits the markets it's going to be even sexier.

anyone else having problems with psn? can't connect to the store after update 1.10.

i wish HBOGO would make its way to the PS4 already.

It will prob be a while. Does it work in the web browser? (Kinda doubt it)

Why will it be a while? It's on PS3 and Xbone no?

Just got released for xbone tho right?
Just a guess given the lag between 360 and ps3 release of the app

Maybe ms paid a premium. Ugh.

Needs a snowboarding game

Won murdered soul suspect and the last of us this week on a Facebook raffle page for about £12! Unfortunately nobody seems to know when last of us is out, it was rumoured for next week but Sony have said it's not.....

I think it'll be announced at e3 and will be out soon

Last of Us was a great game, but I'm not buying it again for PS4 unless it was like $10 or something.

Those who didn't play it on PS3 - highly recommended.

Ya I didn't get it for 3 but will def buy it on 4

Last of Us was great, but I won't buy it for ps4 either. The dlc was disappointing, and didn't really see a lot of replay value in it.

I'm paying $50 to play Last of Us again for PS4. I kinda played through it quickly for PS3.

The multiplayer for Last Of Us is highly underrated imo