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Problem : Always finding myself valuetowed on showdown, or folded at half pot bet Problem : Always finding myself valuetowed on showdown, or folded at half pot bet

11-17-2013 , 03:20 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by chr1s82p
personally i would 3bet here, too. dependent on the reads. but i thought op is still early in his development as a poker player. and then i think there is plenty of opportunity in the future for making such plays. when op gets more confident.
very very tue, but people only learn good spots if you tell them, I usually find poker forums (the hand history sections) very uninformativeas there usually people giving an answer wihout an informed opinion or reason. Probably a good thing though as learning these things is part of understanding the game.
Problem : Always finding myself valuetowed on showdown, or folded at half pot bet Quote
11-17-2013 , 03:46 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by chr1s82p
5th hand:
maybe make a bigger turn bet. flush draw and straight draw here. take the pot down or make them pay big. the bigger bet is also for information. when someone calls a big bet here you have to ask yourself twice if you have the best hand. i would be happy to get the pot right now.
obv i meant slightly bigger. 3/4 pot.
Problem : Always finding myself valuetowed on showdown, or folded at half pot bet Quote
11-17-2013 , 07:34 PM
I used to have an incredibly similar problem so I feel you. My non-showdown line on my graph was amazing while my showdown line tanked. Consider; what hands are calling you when you bet these percentages? How might you keep in the hands you beat and when do they hit? Then; how do I bet to get those hands to continue calling, and what do they call my value bets with? My error was blowing off all the hands that missed while only getting hands that beat me to call down. Seems like you could be in a similar space.
Problem : Always finding myself valuetowed on showdown, or folded at half pot bet Quote
11-20-2013 , 12:44 AM
I really need a primer on bet sizing for extracting value. On the last few hands I've posted on the forum I have repeatedly told to bet higher, when I know from experience that betting over half the pot exponentially increases the odds of Villain folding the Flop. I rarely meet maniacs and calling stations, most of fish villains at the micros are weak-tight and they tend to fold at the slightest over half-pot.

So when should I bet for value at half pot? 2/3? 3/4? When should I increase the size of the bet, given that if I bet full pot it still gives Villain 33% pot odds? When I bet more than half the pot it's always to "defend" myself against a draw of some kind.


    Poker Stars, $0.01/$0.02 No Limit Hold'em Cash, 6 Players
    Poker Tools Powered By Holdem Manager - The Ultimate Poker Software Suite. View Hand #20934501

    SB: $2.66 (133 bb)
    BB: $1.27 (63.5 bb)
    UTG: $0.94 (47 bb)
    Hero (MP): $2.03 (101.5 bb)
    CO: $4.62 (231 bb)
    BTN: $3.30 (165 bb)

    Preflop: Hero is MP with K K
    UTG calls $0.02, Hero raises to $0.08, CO calls $0.08, 4 folds

    Flop: ($0.21) 6 J T (2 players)
    Hero bets $0.16, CO folds

    Results: $0.21 pot ($0.01 rake)
    Final Board: 6 J T
    Hero mucked K K and won $0.20 ($0.12 net)
    CO mucked and lost (-$0.08 net)



    Get the Flash Player to use the Hold'em Manager Replayer.
    Problem : Always finding myself valuetowed on showdown, or folded at half pot bet Quote
    11-20-2013 , 05:29 AM
    Hand 1. Do not call pre. Pump up the aggression. A8s is a great hand to be 3betting from the blinds with. As played you can make a tough fold on the river because he makes his raise sizing so huge, but it's understandable you make the call here with aces up, especially because he reps so little.

    Hand 2. Do not raise pre, fold it. You don't want to get involved in a pot with 97o after MP limped in, you want better hands for that. Post flop is fine and **** happens sometimes.

    Hand 3. Raise pre. As played, post flop is fine.

    Hand 4. Fine. Note that just as in the previous hand you only lost a small pot.

    Hand 5. Fine.

    Hand 6. Pre is fine, because likely UTG will overcall and you can get a multiway pot with a suited connector, but if BTN had opened here you would have to 3bet this. Postflop, make a smaller raise to like $0.27.

    Hand 7. You can make a slightly smaller raise, or even flat call, because the board is relatively dry.

    Hand 8. Don't donk flop, it's a great spot for a check-call. As played, you can fold after he raises. River bet is fine. Note again, you lost a relatively small pot when he has a full house against your straight.

    Hand 9. Folding or calling river is close here, but I'm leaning towards a fold.

    Hand 10. You played this one fine, but check-fold the river. He always has you beat here when he raises.

    Hand 11. Fine.
    Problem : Always finding myself valuetowed on showdown, or folded at half pot bet Quote
    11-20-2013 , 05:36 AM
    As a general rule, keep making thin value bets when you have TP or better and just fold when passive villains suddenly get aggressive, either by donking or by raising.

    You can't make villains auto-magically call every cbet or raise when you have the nuts, and make them fold whenever you are bluffing.

    Don't get tilted when they fold when you have an overpair or a set, there will be a hand when you can get three streets of fat value form it, you just have to be patient.

    The way I see it is that I more or less break even or lose slightly on all those hands where I just raise pre and everyone folds, or I cbet and either take down the pot or have to give up, or I hit something nice but have to surrender to villain's aggression. Then after a while *that* hand comes along where I hit the mortal nuts and get to stack an opponent. That will be my profit.
    Problem : Always finding myself valuetowed on showdown, or folded at half pot bet Quote

          
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