Pre-flop Raising Standards.
07-18-2009
, 08:18 PM
Hi there Im a relative newbie to cash games, currently grinding the nano stakes of 5NL but wanted to get my pre-flop action down to a tee before i move up.Im aware there is plenty of pre-flop raising threads on this forum, but a lot are centered around tournaments and/or Full Ring tables, Im yet to spot anything for 6max cash games [please link to me if there's anything I've missed]
I've seen quite a lot of people on here, raising different amounts pre-flop, with different hands and different positons. Now i know there is never a set answer, as games and stakes vary but I'd like to get people thoughts on this.
x3 Vs x4
I've usually been one for raising x3 having a tournament background, though recently I've tried out x4 as it seems quite a lot of people on here advocate raising x4. Here I've tried out a little math, which i hope is correct:
e.g for 5NL, raise x3 - $0.15 - to win $0.07, [(7/15)*100 = 46] means it has to work 46% of the time to break even.
e.g for 5NL, raise x4 - $0.20 - to win $0.07, [(7/20)*100 = 35] means it has to work 35% of the time to break even.
I think generally x3 is good for weaker hands, risking less to steal blinds and then Hero can Cbet smaller, and risk less, to win the pot. However, for good hands when raising for value x4 seems more appropriate as the larger pot pre-flop increases the bet amount over 4 streets and thus means more value. In an ideal world I think raising x3 for stealing and x4 for value would be perfect, however this is practically playing our hands face up. Does x4 seem too big of a raise for donks though? Will a smaller bet induce more calls with weaker hands for your big pairs?
Varying raise according to position.
And secondly i wanted to ask what people think to raising different amounts in different positions. I know in Phil Gordons book, and in a couple of the FT academy videos they suggest raising small in EP, slightly larger in Mid and even larger in LP - as their table position improves their raise amounts increase as they are confident their positional advantage will allow this to be +ev irrelevant of hands.
However, I've seen a couple of people talk of raising smaller in late postion [Infact i watched threads13 latest video of him just raising 2.3/2.3 on the button] because i) you have a wider range of hands that you don't want to be building a big pot with; ii) a smaller raise means you a risking little to win the blinds and thus means the move has work to less for it to be profitable.
Sorry this is long, but all thoughts welcome
I've seen quite a lot of people on here, raising different amounts pre-flop, with different hands and different positons. Now i know there is never a set answer, as games and stakes vary but I'd like to get people thoughts on this.
x3 Vs x4
I've usually been one for raising x3 having a tournament background, though recently I've tried out x4 as it seems quite a lot of people on here advocate raising x4. Here I've tried out a little math, which i hope is correct:
e.g for 5NL, raise x3 - $0.15 - to win $0.07, [(7/15)*100 = 46] means it has to work 46% of the time to break even.
e.g for 5NL, raise x4 - $0.20 - to win $0.07, [(7/20)*100 = 35] means it has to work 35% of the time to break even.
I think generally x3 is good for weaker hands, risking less to steal blinds and then Hero can Cbet smaller, and risk less, to win the pot. However, for good hands when raising for value x4 seems more appropriate as the larger pot pre-flop increases the bet amount over 4 streets and thus means more value. In an ideal world I think raising x3 for stealing and x4 for value would be perfect, however this is practically playing our hands face up. Does x4 seem too big of a raise for donks though? Will a smaller bet induce more calls with weaker hands for your big pairs?
Varying raise according to position.
And secondly i wanted to ask what people think to raising different amounts in different positions. I know in Phil Gordons book, and in a couple of the FT academy videos they suggest raising small in EP, slightly larger in Mid and even larger in LP - as their table position improves their raise amounts increase as they are confident their positional advantage will allow this to be +ev irrelevant of hands.
However, I've seen a couple of people talk of raising smaller in late postion [Infact i watched threads13 latest video of him just raising 2.3/2.3 on the button] because i) you have a wider range of hands that you don't want to be building a big pot with; ii) a smaller raise means you a risking little to win the blinds and thus means the move has work to less for it to be profitable.
Sorry this is long, but all thoughts welcome
07-18-2009
, 10:02 PM
a lot of questions for 5NL, stick it in
think about value only, and 4times EP, 3times LP
gl if u move up
think about value only, and 4times EP, 3times LP
gl if u move up
07-19-2009
, 06:20 AM