Hey,

villain is 41/10/1,5 AFQ 20%, quite passive, calling w the draws exclusively and didnt make any semi bluff stuff.
What's my plan on turn? Should i betfold, betshove on turn? Or checkcall his pot sized bet? Checkfold? My plan was to check call a smaller bet here and reevaluate river. Was it a big mistake?


Full Tilt Poker $0.10/$0.25 No Limit Hold'em - 6 players
The Official 2+2 Hand Converter Powered By DeucesCracked.com

SB: $29.75
BB: $26.28
Hero (UTG): $25.35
MP: $25.00
CO: $26.05
BTN: $19.82

Pre Flop: ($0.35) Hero is UTG with T T
Hero raises to $0.75, MP calls $0.75, 1 fold, BTN calls $0.75, 2 folds

Flop: ($2.60) 2 T A (3 players)
Hero bets $2, MP folds, BTN calls $2

Turn: ($6.60) J (2 players)
Hero checks, BTN bets $6.60, Hero ?

Well check fold is bad. Check call is also bad as he's not type to semibluff so no point inducing it and with set you want money in.

He still could have draws like flush draw or he could have Ax. Therefore bet turn for value.

If you are 100% positive he never shoves if you bet turn without having TT beat then bet and fold to shove could be good idea. Say you bet to 4$ and he shoves. I'm pretty sure I calculated it right so that it requires 26% equity and you have 22% if you need to boat it up. However I would be less inclined to make that big of a folds so woud rather just bet/call. Mistake you make if he has KQ is smaller than folding if he has say AJ or 22 and you fold...

If he raises smaller than shove then check whether you have odds to boat up if you think you likely need it.

But start turn by betting for value. You are beat only by KQ, AA and JJ and he'll call with any flushdraw(and now there's 2), Ax hands, 2 pairs etc for sure.

Why are you checking the turn?

bet/bet/bet, if he raises good, we get it in.

well, if hes passive, you should just bet yourself.

as played, shove.

Thanks guys for the great advices. My problem in these spots is that my nitty inner came out of me and see that KQ, AA, JJ is beating me. I know it's a very bad approach and try getting rid of it.
That's why I checked here and actually was surprised to his PSB bet. But yeah, should have betted the turn and reevaluate from there.

Thing is, that this kind of dude has much much much more hands in his range that you beat. (seriously count all the 2pair comboes he can have, possible pair+draw etc.)

Well he did say opponent is passive and never raises with draws. That sort of players are unlikely be raising even with pair+draw type of hands. Maybe AK/AQ of spade he might raise.

So if he raises set could be in trouble as main hands you are beating would be AJ, very unlikely JT and 22.

However pot odds are then pretty good and you certainly can't check there so you are in "tough luck" spot. Can't really check and if he shoves you are pretty much forced to do crying call if opponent is passive one who doesn't raise with draws due to pot odds + few combo's he could be valueshoving.

I'm sure that his turn bet is a made hand (maybe I'm wrong) and he's not bluffing with a draw here. Of course, he could overestimate his TP, 2pair type hands here. Or he's doing it with the better AA, JJ, KQ here. At the end I folded.

How the f can you fold here? Seriously? Wtf are you doing? You have the nuts vs a ****** fish. Keep putting money in the middle until you run out of money.

CHECKING THE TURN IS ******ED
BET BET SHOVE
WE CAN NOT CHECK THE TURN, THERE IS NOW A DOUBLE FLUSH DRAW, THE BOARD IS AXX, FISH PLAY AX HANDS, WE VALUE BET THE TURN AND SHOVE THE RIVER

+1 TO WHAT TUKKKKKKKKKA SAID

WOW. I was told about this forums from players that claimed 2+2 as a big reason for ther success. I was told that the handhistoryforums here was overcrowded of very solid and good players.

Then I come across alot of nits in each and other thread.

OP, checking this turn is really really bad. Just BET, BET, BET, and if this passive fish somwhere wakes up along our three streets of value then fine, get it in and be happy about it.

Guys! I'm here on the forum to learn from more experienced players and to fix my leaks, there are couple of ones. If I would be that good wouldnt have posted this hand and would play at higher limits. Yeah I folded, I'm ******ed, but not a nit.

FYP

do you understand why betting is far better than checking now?

Don't be a douche. There is one person who is timidly advocating a possible fold (besides the OP). OP doesn't know, that's why he came here to ask the question. People claim 2+2 as a big reason for their success because they can come here and post things and learn from better players. That is EXACTLY what is happening in this thread, minus your douchebaggery.

Even if we decide to take out pair+fd hands, he still has all the 2pair type hands. He is 41/10/1,5. 41! OFC he has a lot more 2pair type comboes in his range than JT. AJ,AT,A2,JT maybe even T2/J2. Pokerstove that including sets. That is why we bet/bet/bet and that is why we are going to get it in. And we are damn happy to get it in.

Thanks, that's the point here

Got the message, that was I was looking for.

thats good

fwiw, in public free forums, thicken ur skn up a bit and take everyone advise with a pinch of salt, until u understand the exact reasons why they say xyz, forget all the negative posts!! and use all the helpful posts

if u dont understand something just say, if u feel people are wrong- argue, ive had so much aaaaaaahh moments, and see some of my own flawed thinking during these

also consider dropping down from nl25. from the two threads i've seen you make you are definately should not be playing nl25

This is a good post. You are a nit though. You have to stack off that hand. That might be the nittiest fold I have seen in a long time.

Actually I'm in the phase of stepping up to NL25, I'm beating NL10. Got some very nice coolers at the beginning and it affected me somehow in similar situations when fishes came up w KQ in spots like this. When everybody tells you that you should ship, because his range includes all the junk hands you are beating, but at the end they always come up with the nut hand when they bet pot.
Anyway I'm winning at NL25 as well, but it's still not that much due to hands like this.

buddy, anything but bet/calling the turn seems terrible

I think you are playing quite nitty style if planning to fold this turn against a fish. I think not betshoving the turn here is a terrible mistake.

It´s not a mistake ever. It´s the only way to go