Open Side Menu Go to the Top
Register
NL100, QQ I flop set, river is tough spot for me NL100, QQ I flop set, river is tough spot for me

01-07-2010 , 06:07 AM
Villain is unknown

Full Tilt Poker $0.50/$1 No Limit Hold'em - 8 players
The Official 2+2 Hand Converter Powered By DeucesCracked.com

BTN: $95.95
Hero (SB): $115.70
BB: $110.55
UTG: $100.00
UTG+1: $100.00
MP1: $90.20
MP2: $63.00
CO: $167.50

Pre Flop: ($1.50) Hero is SB with Q Q
1 fold, UTG+1 raises to $3, 3 folds, BTN calls $3, Hero calls $2.50, BB calls $2

Flop: ($12.00) K Q 5 (4 players)
Hero checks, BB checks, UTG+1 bets $8, BTN folds, Hero raises to $21, BB folds, UTG+1 calls $13

Turn: ($54.00) 4 (2 players)
Hero bets $34, UTG+1 calls $34

River: ($122.00) J (2 players)
Hero ?

so is river a c/f then? Also, I 3bet preflop here often, just this time I felt like calling, can we agree that is ok?
NL100, QQ I flop set, river is tough spot for me Quote
01-07-2010 , 06:39 AM
you have an effective $42 behind if i can count. I'd shove here. On 25NL villain mostly will have 2 pair or KK, 55. Unless you have reason to believe that he might be a fish and was going for that flush.

Still, on 25NL against an unknown i'd get it in and shrug if he shows a flush.
On 100NL i have no clue what to do except get it in
NL100, QQ I flop set, river is tough spot for me Quote
01-07-2010 , 07:01 AM
You made your river decesion hard based on your turn bet size. Had you put in a larger turn bet your river would be rather easy in this case as you would not have that much behind. You put the villain in a spot where he has to call $34 into a pot of $88. Essentially you priced him in the whole way here assuming hes getting any implied odds here. I like a PSB on the turn as hes already called a check raise so he clearly has a very good hand and you do not want to see that last club roll off.

That being said with the Kc and Qc on the board what 2 club hands are in his range other then A10c in which case he just made a royal and you get to pay him off. With that logic the river shouldent really change anything with the way you play the hand, assuming hes a compitent player, this is a great spot to have table ratings open and fire in his SN. If hes making money he does not have 2 clubs here.
NL100, QQ I flop set, river is tough spot for me Quote
01-07-2010 , 07:08 AM
No one likes a 3-bet pre then??
NL100, QQ I flop set, river is tough spot for me Quote
01-07-2010 , 07:12 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by jewbinson
No one likes a 3-bet pre then??
I do, 3 way pot oop with QQ not fun

I also like a bigger flop raise as well, which will essentially get you all in by the turn.

Why are you so worried about club hands? Assuming villain is semi normal, the only flush drawing hands that are in his range from UTG+1 are AKcc and AQcc, both of which can't have happened here, AJcc is now out as well, and AT is a very unlikely holding (How would he ever get to this river with AT unless he opened utg+1 with ATcc?). I'm having a hard time imagining 2 clubs that are still in his opening range given K, Q, and J of clubs on the board. Ship it.

Last edited by VeeSe; 01-07-2010 at 07:18 AM.
NL100, QQ I flop set, river is tough spot for me Quote
01-07-2010 , 07:12 AM
If you checked and villain shoved his remaining $42, you would be getting, roughly, 4-to-1 odds. Hard to resist, I must say. Without stats and reads, I would call.

On the flop, I would've raised to $35 or so.
NL100, QQ I flop set, river is tough spot for me Quote
01-07-2010 , 07:13 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by jewbinson
No one likes a 3-bet pre then??
no, i do actually. looking back on it, I think I should be leaning towards a 3bet especially vs an unknown
NL100, QQ I flop set, river is tough spot for me Quote
01-07-2010 , 07:15 AM
also, i did end up jamming and he had the flush, meh ill call it a cooler i guess...
NL100, QQ I flop set, river is tough spot for me Quote
01-07-2010 , 07:18 AM
preflop : call or 3bet is fine...
flop : i would raise to 24-25$
turn : with your flopbet, i would bet about 39-41$, sometimes cauz of the the draws a little bit more
river : i would never fold... its more likely, he has something like AK,KQ than a set or a flush... dont see many flushs in the range of a utg+1-raise here and AT neither, so i would never fold... maybe c/c or just shove... i probably would just shove

*edit*
and since you are committing yourself on turn, i think, he would shove any set there cauz of the draws, so really.. never fold river
NL100, QQ I flop set, river is tough spot for me Quote
01-07-2010 , 07:18 AM
of course i like a 3bet against an unknown oop with QQ, but OP already said, his play here was an exception. (wouldn't do that myself, cause imo variing your play is for villians you have played a lot and here we have an unknown).
what do you think about a c/r to $27-28, this would leave a psb on the turn!?

edit: oh well, three replies when i started to write, everything said when i've finished^^
NL100, QQ I flop set, river is tough spot for me Quote
01-07-2010 , 07:21 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by HeavyNapa88
no, i do actually. looking back on it, I think I should be leaning towards a 3bet especially vs an unknown
If you have CR I would take a look at Kush789's videos. He talks alot about the fact that if you 3b this your just turning QQ into a bluff as hes never going to shove with anything your ahead of and if he does shove you will just fold anyway.

Lets assume hes not a total donkey he could reaize you just 3b his EP raise oop and your range is going to be strong here, doing it with the 3rd best hand in poker is probally not the way to extract max value out of a good player.
NL100, QQ I flop set, river is tough spot for me Quote

      
m