Hello everyone

after some time i wanna post some hands again, so here we go!!


this hand i played today vs a fish, i had no notes on him, he had 46/42 stats on just 52 hands..

i just wasnt sure about my hand all the way trough... i dont know if the flop play is good with just a call, bcs i was afraid of isolating myself vs stronger hands, but was also scared of a semibluff with a flushdraw. So i decided to bet the turn myself incase he was drawing, at that point i think i even wouldve called a raise here?? idk if that wouldve been good but it would be nice if we could discuss this too!

after the flat on the turn i felt pretty confident just hoping not to put an overcard there , so i jammed it myself


PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em, $0.10 BB (6 handed) - PokerStars Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com

CO ($19.96)
Button ($9.47)
SB ($9.27)
BB ($10)
Hero (UTG) ($12.87)
MP ($10)

Preflop: Hero is UTG with J, J
Hero bets $0.30, MP raises to $0.95, 4 folds, Hero calls $0.65

Flop: ($2.05) 10, 8, 2 (2 players)
Hero checks, MP bets $1.18, Hero calls $1.18

Turn: ($4.41) 5 (2 players)
Hero bets $2.20, MP calls $2.20

River: ($8.81) 8 (2 players)
Hero bets $8.54 (All-In), MP calls $5.67 (All-In)

Total pot: $20.15 | Rake: $0.91

What's his 3b stat? Why are you donking the turn?

his 3bet is 53% lol.. he was very aggro at the table, and like i said i just have him on a draw so often and like lets say its a big draw? sth like AKs or any ace draw ak aq maybe aj and a8 hes gonna check behind with lots of draws and not bet, but hes gonna call them so if he calls in that spot i'm super confident that he doesnt have an overpair bcs he wouldve raised me on turn with anything super strong ( trips^^) and its super unlikely that he maybe has two pair ( t8) that he would not 3bet but just call down..


its a tuff play tho i would agree, since if he raises me its a very difficult spot... wich he would be doing probably with all his draws >_<... so yea kinda lost

With a 53% 3bet why not just 4B shove pre? He may call with a whole set of middle pairs which you crush and broadways where you are a flip or better, plus you get a bunch of FE. You are typically going to see overcards here and be in a difficult position oop post flop.

You are losing to 2% of his range, make him pay.

i dont understand this play tho bcs in my mind its not gonna work like that, maybe it will but, i still think that those people know how to react to the 4b especially if he does it so frequently and i just think that hes going to call me fairly tight.. not saying kk+ ak, but still i dont think hell call with worse then jj+ AQ and the rest of his 53% is going to fold..

i never saw fish donking it so hard with broadways 100BB in nl10 lol..

i dont understand this play tho bcs in my mind its not gonna work like that, maybe it will but, i still think that those people know how to react to the 4b especially if he does it so frequently and i just think that hes going to call me fairly tight.. not saying kk+ ak, but still i dont think hell call with worse then jj+ AQ and the rest of his 53% is going to fold..

i never saw fish donking it so hard with broadways 100BB in nl10 lol..

4bet-$3/call pre imo. None of our options are really very attractive but I feel like this is by far our best option.

You're going to find it very hard playing this hand OOP to a maniac. You're way ahead of his 3betting range so a 4bet is in order. This will let you keep control of the pot and give you an easy flop shove if you don't get it all in pre.

He has to care a lot more about your range post-flop if you 4bet rather than just flat, and he won't be deep enough to bluff you off what will be the better hand most of the time against this villain.

If you had position pre-flop, a flat call might be better value - as long as you're prepared to play it strongly post-flop. If you're not prepared to stand up to him post-flop, then just push pre in or out of position.

As played, I'm donking the flop in the hope that he raises me, or check-raising all in if I think he'll call.

It is still EV+ if you believe his range is that tight (but high variance).

92% of the time he folds in that scenario, against his range you have 43% equity:

.92*1.4 + .8*.43*10.45-.8*.57*9.7=0.46

In that world the 4B is probably better, but you have to decide: Does he call with the same hands as the shove? If so, you better c/f the flop and your 4 bet was a bluff. If you think his range is broader to call the 4B then you are pretty much committed now and you can shove OTF -- but getting the answer wrong will give you -EV compared to the shove.

If you think he shoves with 88+ and AJ+ you have 54% equity and that play is worth 2.23 and becomes pretty compelling.

hi,

i dont understand how you mean "but getting the answer wrong will give you -EV compared to the shove.", what u compare to the shove? 4bet and c/f flop or what? do u mean shove pre on the 3bet ? i dont understand what u are saying :S

in case i 4bet, how high should i make it? i'm just scared or let down by a scenario where i 4bet and he calls i bet ai on a flop like this and he folds.. because i just dont give him much room to do anything and at that point i just think that he will only call me with any better hand ... or did you mean check/fold the flop in case of a 4bet?

i dont like the 4bet mainly bcs i'm not sure of the size of the bet, and in the end i would have to bet pot on the flop to get it in, or hope he bets if i check...

also,

i dont understand this though process at all... if i 4bet him OOP pre then i could be forced to c/f alot of flops with high cards K Q or A.. so i give him much more oportunity to bluff no?

What was the outcome? it looks to me like you're up against AA-JJ, AT,KT, maybe QT, TT, 88, and T8. of which you beat 2 maybe 3.. i think i like 4 betting pre flop in order to protect your hand. i realize not many worse hands call, but playing this hand oop position is obviously not fun and if an overcard comes you're gonna have to fold the best hand a lot. as played i think a c/r OTF and if he continues i would probably c/f the turn. i'd also try to look at bet sizing.. if he pots the turn i'd be more willing to give up versus half pot or a shove.

When you flat call, you tell him you don't have a huge hand. He can continue to represent a huge hand post-flop, in position, and make life very difficult for you.

If you had position, flat-calling and making his life difficult would be better, but you don't.

You don't want to play a big pot with a weak hand out of position. You're almost certainly ahead of him now, so get it in - push pre or 4bet and push any flop. You can't give him free cards, whether you flat call or 4bet here. Your hand is too vulnerable and his range too wide.

4betting might also discourage him from 3betting you light in future, but this depends on how much attention he pays and whether he has more passive targets to focus on.

how can he rep a big hand for himself if he has 54% 3bet lol? the reasoning is that IF i 4bet i isolate myself against his calling range super hard so i just think that his 5bet range must be super tight, kk+ and his 4bet calling range must be tight aswell, so if i see a flop with the cards higher then my jacks how can i push it then?!

in my mind i always want to think of a line that not only makes him pay off with equal hands or better, but also with hands that are worse then mine, and if i 4bet i just dont see him paying me off enough to make the play worth it :S

4bet push pre for me seems to be the only other viable option other than flat call, bcs if u flat call him you just get alot of bluffs from him and you got to understand that his 50%! 3bet hands get me much more value then if i isolate myself against his range hard and THEN find myself in a much toughter spot playing oop in a 4bet pot

You need to think about how position affects that strategy.

If you call and check the flop, he is betting it and he should be betting most turns too. Most of the time, there will be an overcard. What are you going to do? Check/call three streets? Fold the best hand most of the time?

I've already said that a flat call in position would be fine. Out of position with JJ against a maniac it's burning money. You give yourself terrible reverse implied odds when you almost certainly have the best hand, and let him get away cheaply if you play back at all.

If you called in order to trap him into bluffing off his stack, then there is no need to post this hand - you should just check/call him down regardless and be happy about it. If you didn't call with that plan in mind, then you need to think about why you are in this ****ty spot to begin with.

Position is everything.

i'll take it in consideration..

end of the hand:

PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em, $0.10 BB (6 handed) - PokerStars Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com

CO ($19.96)
Button ($9.47)
SB ($9.27)
BB ($10)
Hero (UTG) ($12.87)
MP ($10)

Preflop: Hero is UTG with J, J
Hero bets $0.30, MP raises to $0.95, 4 folds, Hero calls $0.65

Flop: ($2.05) 10, 8, 2 (2 players)
Hero checks, MP bets $1.18, Hero calls $1.18

Turn: ($4.41) 5 (2 players)
Hero bets $2.20, MP calls $2.20

River: ($8.81) 8 (2 players)
Hero bets $8.54 (All-In), MP calls $5.67 (All-In)

Total pot: $20.15 | Rake: $0.91



not to be results oriented, but i played that hand like a genius.