nl10 5max cash game 4handed
played 2 orbits so far at this table. didnt get to showdown so far in any of the hands i won (2preflop, 1OTF, 1OTT). villain has so far at most called pre and chk/folded flop


co fold
btn hero 710 bet 0.30$
sb fold
bb villain [40bb] call 0.30$

flop: 725 pot:0.65$

villain bet 0.20$
hero raise 0.80$
villain call 0.80$

turn 3 pot:1.81$

villain check
hero bet 1.10$
villain call

river 3

villain check
hero? (villain has a potsize bet left)

range? 7 - 45 - 44 - 56 -76?

Notice how u only gave villain a range that u crush. I might even check turn because fish sometime donk small w big one pair hands/draws/Ax hands that brick and sometimes second pair but that is less likely. I think turn bet is okay just to see where we are at but folding to any decent donk OTR and checking down.

What are villain's stats? I'm leaned toward betting again as he is most likely to call you with any 2, 5 44 66 hell sometimes fishes call here with A high, but expect to be beaten some of the times. This is somewhat thin, but good value IMO.

Never ever do info bets. That is bad poker. If you bet there it's some mix of collecting dead money and thin valuebet.

This, but i don't think it's that thin against a SS fish

the only reason I think a thin vbet is okay is because I have seen many fish take this line and fire river w worse and betting turn gets rid of that. Additionally it will charge draws which is generally what fish like to donk with. I'm never betting river tho.

Umm isn't it good if fish fires worse on river?-) You want to make them fold worse hands so they won't give you value on river then

And the concept of charging draws is also bit misnamed. Charging draws=same as valuebet.

i think the turn is a perfect card to get value from a player that sits with less than 100bb (typical passiv bit station donk) bec he will have pair+draw more often than a strong made hand, and obv im always ahead of that range + he is not very likely to checkshove turn with pair+draw bec i raise the flop and it surely doesnt look like im going to fold. not sure about river though.. no stats on villain.

Yeah turn is pretty good card to go for thin vbet. As you said there's crapload of pair+draws or combo draws he can have. If he raises then it's obviously time to fold.

River I would say is check back. He could have small overpair(88-99) that beats you, J7 or bigger so unless he calls there with smaller pairs than 7 you aren't getting called by worse.

I might bet it tad smaller though to encourage him call lighter as in any case you are talking about thin value here. You are never getting better hands to fold even if you bet bigger. Though 1.1$ is fine as well.

Not sure I'm fan of the flop raise though without reads on what sort of hands he donks and calls raises with. You aren't getting any better hands to fold. Not wettest flop to begin with so not many draws he could have that call on flop.

We get value from villains draws and fold out his Ax hands that we do not gain value from the river anyway. Basically, we can see where we are OTT because most fish will take this line w a draw and villain will not raise us w a draw. Fish can call a turn bet w draws, AK, second pairs, worse TP hands, and better TP hands.

EDIT: I know I said Ax hands fold but usually fish have a really hard time folding AK to bets on a low board.

You said "and fire river w worse and betting turn gets rid of that."

If they fire river with worse we don't mind them staying around. If they fold those on turn then we get no value from those on turn and lose value from those hand on river

We never NEVER NEVER bet to see where we are at. That's NEVER reason to bet. That's reason to bet if you want to play bad poker

Hell from your reply alone we can tell instantly information bets don't work because we don't GET accurate information. He calls and we STILL don't know are we ahead or behind.

Information bets/raises were shown to be bad poker years ago.

I quite like taking a b,c,b line on this board.
If opponent has a deeper stack its good for pot control, and 10NL players often call super light against this line, Ax + weak one pair hands etc.

I dont disagree with you, I just think I should of worded my post better. My last post I told you what villain calls worse w OTR. I think both lines of bet/bet/cf or bet/check/call or bet are acceptable.