JJ foldable in 3bet pot? - Micro Stakes Pot Limit and No Limit

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JJ foldable in 3bet pot?

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07-16-2009 , 08:43 PM

Figool

centurion

Join Date: May 2007 Posts: 197

Full Tilt Poker $2/$4 No Limit Hold'em - 5 players
The Official 2+2 Hand Converter Powered By DeucesCracked.com

BB: $102.90
UTG: $448.70
CO: $372.30
Hero (BTN): $424.00
SB: $408.00

Pre Flop: ($6.00) Hero is BTN with J

UTG raises to $12, 1 fold, Hero raises to $42, 2 folds, UTG calls $30

Flop: ($90.00) 9

(2 players)
UTG checks, Hero bets $64, UTG calls $64

Turn: ($218.00) 4

(2 players)
UTG checks, Hero bets $120, UTG raises to $342.70 all in

villain plays 20/15 over 150 hands.
i think his range here is cut down nearly only to 3 hands.
99,TT,QQ.
I expect him to reraise KK and AA preflop or on the Flop.
any way to fold here? i just think im beat very often.

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07-16-2009 , 08:54 PM

NxtWrldChamp

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Feb 2008 Posts: 9,082

considering how tight you play I dont think it is in your best interest to be 3 betting UTG opens with JJ... especially since i have a feeling you are going to be folding to a 4bet/shove which is very bad

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07-16-2009 , 09:00 PM

lnternet

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Feb 2009 Posts: 12,224

im not b/folding JJ no way

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07-16-2009 , 09:02 PM

wdead

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Join Date: Apr 2005 Posts: 6,697

I think your pf 3bot is prob marginal unless you have a read that UTG will get in light and I think your turn bet is very marginal since really you only beat TT/88/77 etc and he might fold 88 or 77 pre

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07-16-2009 , 10:10 PM

Figool

centurion

Join Date: May 2007 Posts: 197

Quote:

Originally Posted by NxtWrldChamp

i am not as tight as i have been some time ago.
do u think its allways an auto all in if my 3bets gets 4betted/shoved?what exactly do u mean ?

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07-16-2009 , 10:29 PM

jackwilcox

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Dec 2006 Posts: 9,843

well if u 3bet here, then you should really be looking to play for stacks since JJ is one of your value hands for 3betting with. therefore assuming villain 4bets you should be looking to shove.

if you arent comfortable getting it in (tbh i wouldnt be particularly comfortable getting it in vs utg here) then you should just flat instead of assuming that he is going to be flatting 99 and TT against you, and only 4betting QQ+ and AK

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07-16-2009 , 11:06 PM

NxtWrldChamp

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Join Date: Feb 2008 Posts: 9,082

Quote:

Originally Posted by Figool

i am not as tight as i have been some time ago.
do u think its allways an auto all in if my 3bets gets 4betted/shoved?what exactly do u mean ?

i just mean that if i was you and i was trying to open up my game a little bit more, I would start 3 betting in this situation with more speculative hands until people start to adjust to you 3 betting more. Once they start playing back at you more then you can start to add in some slighty thinner value hands like JJ here.

Pretty much if you are going to be 3 betting a hand for value like this you are not going to want to be folding it for 100 BBs.

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07-16-2009 , 11:21 PM

LAGBOMB

centurion

Join Date: Jun 2009 Posts: 104

I stand by the theory that JJ is the 2nd worst hand in poker next to AJ. I don't see how you can fold here however, the only thing that beats you in villian's range is QQ, KK,AA, or a set. You still beat about 50% of his range, also if he doesn't think you have a pp he could easily be stealing here with AK/AQ. Especially now that he picked up a gut shot and knows he's not dead and still has 2 overs.

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07-17-2009 , 01:06 AM

Figool

centurion

Join Date: May 2007 Posts: 197

Quote:

Originally Posted by jackwilcox

if you arent comfortable getting it in (tbh i wouldnt be particularly comfortable getting it in vs utg here) then you should just flat instead of assuming that he is going to be flatting 99 and TT against you, and only 4betting QQ+ and AK

Quote:

Originally Posted by NxtWrldChamp

ty both. nice input. i think i found a leak to work at. :-)

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07-17-2009 , 01:39 AM

#10

SA3

veteran

Join Date: Jan 2009 Posts: 3,148

Quote:

Originally Posted by NxtWrldChamp

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07-17-2009 , 02:28 AM

#11

spino1i

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Join Date: Jul 2005 Posts: 8,713

hmm well if he had c/r'ed the flop youd have an easy fold but i think here you might be too commited and have to call it off.

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07-17-2009 , 02:29 AM

#12

spino1i

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Join Date: Jul 2005 Posts: 8,713

Quote:

Originally Posted by jackwilcox

this. 3-betting JJ here is only good with LAG image.

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07-17-2009 , 06:28 AM

#13

Bullitos

old hand

Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 1,376

If your image is as tight as some are saying you should indeed flat preflop and probably potcontrol turn. As played you're getting great odds, but I can't imagine him doing this with TT with your image right? You're just way way behind here too often, so folding seems ok.

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07-17-2009 , 07:58 AM

#14

BobbyLight

old hand

Join Date: Oct 2007 Posts: 1,651

Given villain is 20/15, solid and knows OP plays tight does anybody hate checking the turn for pot control? (even though this is a good board for our hand, you would think).

I'm trying not to be results oriented but how often against this guy, given our image, are we going to be ahead when it goes bet, bet, shove.

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