*******HU CASH Regs thread******* - Page 522 - Micro Stakes Pot Limit and No Limit

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01-14-2010 , 09:26 PM

#13026

salsathekid

old hand

Join Date: May 2009 Posts: 1,683

Quote:

Originally Posted by enty

now im just confused
pros and cons ? what does our villain need to be.

flop 9d -> str8 flush > quads

Ahh, I see. I'd be crying like a bitch and my computer would be broken.

Quote

01-14-2010 , 09:30 PM

#13027

moose stuff

old hand

Join Date: Jan 2010 Posts: 1,260

It hurts me to get beaten by red pros.... asdf;asdflajdf;las

Quote

01-14-2010 , 09:32 PM

#13028

Clayton

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Oct 2004 Posts: 32,237

FTP HU players who are sick of the table hierarchy being rewarded to people that sit all day on the "A" tables and refuse action to anyone who doesn't buy in with their cashier, please post here and hopefully something is done:

link

Quote

01-14-2010 , 10:48 PM

#13029

Halfwitted

old hand

Join Date: Feb 2009 Posts: 1,332

if he calls a lot 4bet is good, if he either folds or 5bets then it's bad

Quote

01-14-2010 , 10:49 PM

#13030

Barge Ass

Pooh-Bah

Join Date: Dec 2007 Posts: 3,847

Yeah I just wouldn't do it 400 deep because I don't particularly want to get it in.

Quote

01-15-2010 , 12:09 AM

#13031

jongreenway

old hand

Join Date: Mar 2007 Posts: 1,205

Quote:

Originally Posted by Barge Ass

Yeah I just wouldn't do it 400 deep because I don't particularly want to get it in.

Wait becuase you 4 bet you have to get it in pf?

Quote

01-15-2010 , 12:26 AM

#13032

Barge Ass

Pooh-Bah

Join Date: Dec 2007 Posts: 3,847

Most of the time yeah. If I'm 4 betting for value I'm not folding to shove (maybe a small %). I'd rather not 4 bet JJ and fold. I'd rather 4 bet 86s and fold.

Quote

01-15-2010 , 12:30 AM

#13033

jongreenway

old hand

Join Date: Mar 2007 Posts: 1,205

Quote:

Originally Posted by Barge Ass

Most of the time yeah. If I'm 4 betting for value I'm not folding to shove (maybe a small %). I'd rather not 4 bet JJ and fold. I'd rather 4 bet 86s and fold.

I'd 5b you a large % of the time and print money vs you then. You'd be better off not 4 betting at all.

It's OK to 4bet/fold if your villain has a huge 4bet calling range (lot of people spaz call 4 bets) and only 5bet the nuts. A ton of people are like this.

Quote

01-15-2010 , 12:43 AM

#13034

rbracco

Pooh-Bah

Join Date: May 2007 Posts: 4,605

Quote:

Originally Posted by Barge Ass

If I'm 4 betting for value I'm not folding to shove (maybe a small %).

Yeah 300+bb deep, you can't use blanket statements like these that only apply when <100bb deep. It's like taking "never fold top pair heads up" and applying it to a 300+bb situation.

Having JJ in your 4 betting range is what keeps you from getting owned by 5 bets, if your 4bet range is QQ+, AKs and you are fighting back and 4betting a decent amount, you will get owned as jongreenway said.

Also as halfw1tted said, it kind of sucks to 4bet if he 5bets or folds (in less he's a total monkey), and if he calls 4bets it is pretty great.

Quote

01-15-2010 , 01:02 AM

#13035

Barge Ass

Pooh-Bah

Join Date: Dec 2007 Posts: 3,847

Quote:

Originally Posted by jongreenway

True but I don't think a 50NL er is going to be thinking about balance like you are and hence I don't need to have a balanced 4 betting range as I'm never getting exploited by 5 bet bluffs. I'd still rather flat JJ because I feel like I can extract from his weaker range in a 3 bet pot efficiently.

My 4 bet range vs you would be vastly different anyway so it's a moot point.

Quote

01-15-2010 , 01:04 AM

#13036

Barge Ass

Pooh-Bah

Join Date: Dec 2007 Posts: 3,847

Quote:

Originally Posted by rbracco

Right my statement is probably a bit cookie cutter but I think you guys worry too much about balance here.

Quote

01-15-2010 , 01:28 AM

#13037

idcimallin

centurion

Join Date: Nov 2007 Posts: 171

4b is fine with Js, matter of fact, vs. a fish, I'll go $34, maybe even $52.

vs. a reg. need more reads.

Quote

01-15-2010 , 01:28 AM

#13038

nebuer

old hand

Join Date: Jul 2007 Posts: 1,444

Agree with you guys worrying too much about balance. It doesn't matter at all until your opponent KNOWS that you're not 4betting JJ and attempts to exploit it. If you get 3bet and you're holding JJ without history in this situation, balance doesn't even come into it. There's no "oh **** I can't flat JJ because he's going to 5bet me light and own my ass". Make the most +EV play and be conscious about what you show down and notice if he tries to adjust to it.

Playing unexploitably isn't a good thing. It means you're exploiting him less.

Last edited by nebuer; 01-15-2010 at 01:58 AM.

Quote

01-15-2010 , 01:46 AM

#13039

derosnec

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Oct 2005 Posts: 14,295

Quote:

Originally Posted by rbracco

Having JJ in your 4 betting range is what keeps you from getting owned by 5 bets

yup. gotta keep those 50nl players on their toes.

Quote

01-15-2010 , 02:02 AM

#13040

rbracco

Pooh-Bah

Join Date: May 2007 Posts: 4,605

yeah i wasn't thinking against an NL50 fish, i still think 4betting JJ is optimal this deep without a read that villain 5bets or folds.

Quote

01-15-2010 , 02:07 AM

#13041

ICMoney

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Sep 2005 Posts: 8,278

Who's to say we can't flat his 5b and pwn that punk post flop 500bb deep

Quote

01-15-2010 , 03:27 AM

#13042

Barge Ass

Pooh-Bah

Join Date: Dec 2007 Posts: 3,847

Quote:

Originally Posted by derosnec

yup. gotta keep those 50nl players on their toes.

lol dero

Quote

01-15-2010 , 03:59 AM

#13043

Grow

HU Forum Photographer

Join Date: Jan 2008 Posts: 3,249

Can we get a HU4ROLLZ already?

Quote

01-15-2010 , 04:09 AM

#13044

Barge Ass

Pooh-Bah

Join Date: Dec 2007 Posts: 3,847

It's not an epeen swinging heated argument afaik. Just a friendly discussion imo. It benefits all involved.

Quote

01-15-2010 , 04:13 AM

#13045

Grow

HU Forum Photographer

Join Date: Jan 2008 Posts: 3,249

I didn't know there were other arguments.

Quote

01-15-2010 , 04:35 AM

#13046

Barge Ass

Pooh-Bah

Join Date: Dec 2007 Posts: 3,847

HU4RollZ

Quote

01-15-2010 , 08:29 AM

#13047

enty

say 'what' again

Join Date: Nov 2008 Posts: 9,914

thanks for the arguments both ways guys
at the time i was happy getting it in, but in hindsight ive seen him flat AK to a 4bet mostly and not get it in pre, so if he was to 5bet it wouldve probably been QQ+ with some bluffs thrown in right ?

in any case i didnt not think he would flat a 4bet with QQ which is why i got owned on flop i guess.