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good spot to 4-bet shove?(Nl10) good spot to 4-bet shove?(Nl10)

02-19-2012 , 03:46 AM
I had 73 hands on villain.. 17/8/5 player with 33% sqeeze


Grabbed by Holdem Manager
NL Holdem $0.10(BB) Replayer
SB ($19.57)
BB ($8.95)
UTG ($13.54)
UTG+1 ($10.79)
UTG+2 ($10)
MP1 ($10)
Hero ($14.64)
BTN ($19.04)

Dealt to Hero J J

fold, fold, UTG+2 raises to $0.40, MP1 calls $0.40, Hero calls $0.40, BTN calls $0.40, SB raises to $2.50, fold, fold, fold, Hero raises to $14.64 (AI), fold, SB calls $12.14

FLOP ($30.58) 5 T J

TURN ($30.58) 5 T J 3

RIVER ($30.58) 5 T J 3 Q

Hero shows J J
(Pre 53%, Flop 86.3%, Turn 90.9%)
Spoiler:

SB shows K A
(Pre 47%, Flop 13.7%, Turn 9.1%)

SB wins $28.58

regardless of what he had I think JJ is ahead of his range here... any thoughts?

Ty
good spot to 4-bet shove?(Nl10) Quote
02-19-2012 , 03:49 AM
his range is like AK+/JJ+, use pokerstove and figure it out
good spot to 4-bet shove?(Nl10) Quote
02-19-2012 , 03:50 AM
also... what amount of squeeze is too much? I'm thinking over 5%... ?
good spot to 4-bet shove?(Nl10) Quote
02-19-2012 , 05:23 AM
73 hands is not a reliable sample, and his squeeze % will be massively distorted by the limited instances whereby his has had the opportunity to squeeze.

putting in 120+bb's without reliable reads = very bad

fold and wait for better spots. Of which there will be many at 10nl.
good spot to 4-bet shove?(Nl10) Quote
02-19-2012 , 05:25 AM
4bet smaller rather than just a shove which will isolate his calling range to QQ+,AK.
If you are taking this line, you don't mind calling a 5bet-shove because you are 4betting for value.
good spot to 4-bet shove?(Nl10) Quote
02-19-2012 , 05:34 AM
off topic... if I had 2k hands on him and he had the same stats with a 5% sq how would you proceed?
good spot to 4-bet shove?(Nl10) Quote
02-19-2012 , 05:39 AM
by the way, ty all for the comments... i'm learning a lot right now
good spot to 4-bet shove?(Nl10) Quote
02-19-2012 , 05:41 AM
when he raised 2.50 he did it in a 1.80 pot, so I think his range might be wider... any thoughts?
good spot to 4-bet shove?(Nl10) Quote
02-19-2012 , 06:49 AM
I don't hate it but honestly at 10nl I doubt villains are squeezing light in good spots so it makes this pretty thin. Gimme QQ and I'm a lot happier. Gimme TT and the 4b is out of the window.
good spot to 4-bet shove?(Nl10) Quote
02-19-2012 , 07:04 AM
on platforms such as Ipoker you usually play against regs all the time, so these new players are nr.1 on the hit list, cose once they're out of chips, they are gone, and so is the value u had in the pots against them :|, that's why I tend to play a bit more lag style against them ... like this line with JJ... but thinking about it u are right, cose in 200k hand history I remember very few players that will make that play... guess I tought the 33% sq was good enough to shove with JJ :P
good spot to 4-bet shove?(Nl10) Quote
02-19-2012 , 08:11 AM
your sample size is to small to use the sqeeze % and shoving is dumb. you got lucky
good spot to 4-bet shove?(Nl10) Quote
02-19-2012 , 12:27 PM
I'm assuming you flatted UTG+2 because you knew/assumed he was positionally aware and didn't think you could raise JJ for value, and folding is too weak, so a call was the best choice.

Without more information, I personally would assume that SB is also looking at UTG+2's range in the same way, and is therefore less likely to squeeze. (it's possible he has more stats on UTG+2 than we do, but we don't know that).
good spot to 4-bet shove?(Nl10) Quote
02-19-2012 , 01:13 PM
nice to know there are people here who don't know how to use the spoiler
good spot to 4-bet shove?(Nl10) Quote
02-19-2012 , 01:37 PM
At NL10 I don't see SB doing this with anything JJ isn't, at best, flipping with. I'm folding here, and waiting for a better spot.
good spot to 4-bet shove?(Nl10) Quote
02-19-2012 , 02:26 PM
fold vs every pokerstars reg here except for luisritchie and bluffingisme, vs them you can min 4b and theyll insta shove any pair any ace..
good spot to 4-bet shove?(Nl10) Quote
02-19-2012 , 04:00 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by mtagliaf
I'm assuming you flatted UTG+2 because you knew/assumed he was positionally aware and didn't think you could raise JJ for value, and folding is too weak, so a call was the best choice.

Without more information, I personally would assume that SB is also looking at UTG+2's range in the same way, and is therefore less likely to squeeze. (it's possible he has more stats on UTG+2 than we do, but we don't know that).
I don't think he has more reads on utg+2 given I play all the tables at nl10 on ipoker )
good spot to 4-bet shove?(Nl10) Quote
02-19-2012 , 04:11 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chargers In 09
his range is like AK+/JJ+, use pokerstove and figure it out
TBH I think it's more like AK/KK+, he's 'squeezing' four players, showing massive strength.
good spot to 4-bet shove?(Nl10) Quote
02-19-2012 , 04:37 PM
I think u give microstakes players to much credit... but... I might be wrong
good spot to 4-bet shove?(Nl10) Quote
02-19-2012 , 04:42 PM
To ilustrate weird plays at nl10:
The QJ guy is a reg playing 18/14/4.5(steals 46 and folds to 3-bet 65) over 4.6k hands.. see anything weird with his play? )


Grabbed by Holdem Manager
NL Holdem $0.10(BB) Replayer
SB ($24.48)
BB ($24.25)
UTG ($8.26)
Hero ($10)
UTG+2 ($18.55)
MP1 ($5)
MP2 ($9.63)
MP3 ($5)
CO ($18.40)
BTN ($16.23)

Dealt to Hero A A

fold, Hero raises to $0.40, fold, MP1 calls $0.30, fold, fold, fold, fold, fold, BB calls $0.30

FLOP ($1.25) K J 9

BB checks, Hero bets $0.80, MP1 raises to $1.60, BB raises to $4.50, Hero raises to $9.60 (AI), MP1 calls $3 (AI), BB calls $5.10

TURN ($25.05) K J 9 J

RIVER ($25.05) K J 9 J 3

Hero shows A A
(Pre 73%, Flop 3.2%, Turn 4.8%)

MP1 shows T Q
(Pre 11%, Flop 84.8%, Turn 70.2%)

BB shows Q J
(Pre 15%, Flop 12.0%, Turn 25.0%)

MP1 wins $14.05
BB wins $9.33
good spot to 4-bet shove?(Nl10) Quote

      
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