Good/ Bad Bluff - Micro Stakes Pot Limit and No Limit

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Good/ Bad Bluff

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03-28-2010 , 04:54 AM

Mr. Frogg

newbie

Join Date: Mar 2010 Posts: 29

Hey guys

whats your opinion about this?
Hand 1:

Grabbed by Holdem Manager
NL Holdem $0.50(BB) Replayer
SB ($55.44)
BB ($50)
UTG ($56.95)
Hero ($42.85)
BTN ($12.02)

Dealt to Hero A

fold, Hero raises to $1.75, fold, SB calls $1.50, fold

FLOP ($4) 9

SB checks, Hero bets $3, SB calls $3

TURN ($10) 9

SB checks, Hero bets $7.50, SB calls $7.50

RIVER ($25) 9

SB bets $6, [color=red]Hero raises to $30.60 (AI)

Hand 2:

Grabbed by Holdem Manager
NL Holdem $0.50(BB) Replayer
SB ($52.49)
Hero ($34.40)
UTG ($60.98)
UTG+1 ($59.05)
CO ($50.40)
BTN ($57.59)

Dealt to Hero 3

fold, fold, fold, fold, SB raises to $1.50, Hero calls $1

FLOP ($3) 2

SB checks, Hero bets $2.25, SB calls $2.25

TURN ($7.50) 2

SB checks, Hero checks

RIVER ($7.50) 2

[color=red]SB checks, Hero bets $7.20

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03-28-2010 , 05:10 AM

Sappie22

veteran

Join Date: Oct 2009 Posts: 2,831

I dont like Hand 1, he's probably never folding a Queen and if he donked 8x he's obv gonna call as well. I doubt he is donking missed clubs or something on the river. Only that he might fold is 9x.
Hand 2 is fine i guess, i think his range is weighted towards underpairs, and with two overs on the board he is probably folding. I probably bet turn aswell though.

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03-28-2010 , 05:14 AM

Bigheadarch1

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: May 2008 Posts: 7,096

I kinda like hand 1 altho it is very villain dependent.

Hand2 fold pre

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03-28-2010 , 05:42 AM

haffy

journeyman

Join Date: Aug 2007 Posts: 287

What hand are you trying to rep in hand 2 when every draw you could of called with on the flop misses and you pot out on a brick river? If he was paying attention it does look like a missed flush draw a lot, but I doubt he folds jx to anything less.

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03-28-2010 , 07:27 AM

Mr. Frogg

newbie

Join Date: Mar 2010 Posts: 29

Very true

The Second hand is prolly a bad play that i do too often. There is not that much thinking behind i guess and i really try to force myselfe not to do this kind of bluff after a missed draw. Its just too obv. Would be different if i fired the Turn i guess (Hats of to the other player BTW he mad a very good call with AQ high)

First Hand i really like my bluff. I put him on a missed draw or TPNK.

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03-28-2010 , 08:06 AM

AlphaScorpii

Verified Coach CFP, NLHE

Join Date: Feb 2010 Posts: 651

Turn card in second hand is very nice (A would also be) so you should bet turn again. He would probobly call, but I think he must fold on your river bet.

About first hand, usually I've seen those donk bets to induce a raise which happend.

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03-28-2010 , 08:22 AM

Mr. Frogg

newbie

Join Date: Mar 2010 Posts: 29

Hand 1:
Why would he induce a raise on the River? What kind of Hand could he played that slow on the Flop and turn? Only hand is J 10 of Clubs.

He folded pretty quick so i guess he must have missed like i thought.

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03-28-2010 , 08:28 AM

verneer

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Nov 2006 Posts: 6,971

Hand 1: I wouldn't DB the turn. Hand 2, 3-bet or fold preflop.

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03-28-2010 , 08:36 AM

AlphaScorpii

Verified Coach CFP, NLHE

Join Date: Feb 2010 Posts: 651

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mr. Frogg

Hand 1:
He folded pretty quick so i guess he must have missed like i thought.

Where do you see fold?

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03-28-2010 , 08:37 AM

#10

It'sOn

grinder

Join Date: Oct 2009 Posts: 634

Hand 1: c/f turn - betting turn sucks bad; as played, I actually very much like the river shove because villain's small donk screams weakness

Hand 2: fold pre; the only street on which your line makes sense is the flop

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03-28-2010 , 08:42 AM

#11

jooonaz

grinder

Join Date: Feb 2008 Posts: 677

1: c/f turn, not good spot to barrel. I don't like river shove either, many fishes do this bet with a queen because they want cheap showdown but nevertheless they call a raise anyway.

2. fold or 3bet pre. As played 2nd barrel turn, scare card hits and you have great equity.

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03-28-2010 , 08:51 AM

#12

goodgoodstudy

enthusiast

Join Date: Oct 2009 Posts: 82

I like the first one, Base on his line, he may have a weak hand but beat us, and it only need to work 50% to maky this play +EV which depends on the villain, generally I think this bluff is good and your bet is consistent.

The second one I don't like it because you check the turn, if you are try to control the pot, then your hand is not very good why you bet so big on the river? If you are not try to control the pot, this bet looks really like a bluff, it just doesn't make sense.

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03-28-2010 , 08:58 AM

#13

goodgoodstudy

enthusiast

Join Date: Oct 2009 Posts: 82

A lot peaple said we should not bet the turn again at first hand, can you explain a little more? I may not bet the trun also, but I don't know why.

I guess it's because the turn is a blank and he could hit this flop, so the chance he will fold this turn is small. Is there any other reasons?

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03-28-2010 , 09:01 AM

#14

jooonaz

grinder

Join Date: Feb 2008 Posts: 677

Quote:

Originally Posted by goodgoodstudy

You have no equity when called. It's a lot better to barrel with hands that have some outs so when you get called you can hit your miracle cards and profit.

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03-28-2010 , 09:13 AM

#15

Mr. Frogg

newbie

Join Date: Mar 2010 Posts: 29

I fired the turn to rep a big hand. If i check he could call river with a weak hand cause i might missed a draw. As i said i really like my Play here.

@AlphaScorpii: I deleted his fold in hand history here cause i wanted the opinions of you guys.

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03-28-2010 , 11:22 AM

#16

Riverbandit15

journeyman

Join Date: Nov 2009 Posts: 299

I was thinking that the first hand is bad to barrel, as most turn/river cards that are scary hit a lot of hands in his flop c/c range. These boards can be good to float vs. Qx stuff.
2nd hand is definately a fold preflop, as the 'suitedness' of your hand doesn't really apply when you are short.
Buy-in full.

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03-28-2010 , 12:37 PM

#17

Iceman4411

grinder

Join Date: Feb 2010 Posts: 466

hand 1:totally misplayed imo
Question to all:Why are you cbetting this board? I don't get it.
c/f turn but i like your riverplay
His river bet is so often weak.
hand 2: fold pre against unknown imo

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03-28-2010 , 12:45 PM

#18

gotnonick

adept

Join Date: Oct 2009 Posts: 1,132

don't like 1rst hand
2nd hand fire turn big he has a weak pair/weak J and is now folding to the scare card, and you have good equity when called

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