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awkward with 99 awkward with 99

11-04-2008 , 01:51 AM
btn is 22/18. sb is 23/20. sb had been decently active 3betting. i have his overall stat at 8%.

should i be 4betting instead of calling pf given that i think btn will overcall a decent amount and sb can easily be messing about?

on the turn, i had to put btn on AJ or a weakish draw or 55. AJ probably wouldnt overcall pf. so i think my hand is good here. good rationale?

on the river, he shoved pretty quickly. he has a whiffed draw or set imo. call or fold?

thoughts, guys?

Full Tilt Poker $2/$4 No Limit Hold'em - 5 players
The Official 2+2 Hand Converter Powered By DeucesCracked.com

Hero (UTG): $427.80
CO: $628.10
BTN: $888.75
SB: $429.10
BB: $422.00

Pre Flop: ($6.00) Hero is UTG with 9 9
Hero raises to $14, 1 fold, BTN calls $14, SB raises to $60, 1 fold, Hero calls $46, BTN calls $46

Flop: ($184.00) 2 K J (3 players)
SB checks, Hero checks, BTN checks

Turn: ($184.00) 5 (3 players)
SB checks, Hero checks, BTN bets $122, SB folds, Hero requests TIME, Hero calls $122

River: ($428.00) 3 (2 players)
Hero checks, BTN bets $706.75 all in,
awkward with 99 Quote
11-04-2008 , 01:55 AM
pre is baaaad, turn is almost as bad...river would be bad as well but not as bad as earlier streets imo
awkward with 99 Quote
11-04-2008 , 02:12 AM
why is turn bad?
also why is river bad lol? i checked. should i be donkshoving?

Last edited by holdme; 11-04-2008 at 02:21 AM.
awkward with 99 Quote
11-04-2008 , 02:56 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by holdme
on the turn, i had to put btn on AJ or a weakish draw or 55. AJ probably wouldnt overcall pf. so i think my hand is good here. good rationale?

why couldn't he have a flush here?

are there no suited connector or suited ace type hands in his range PF?
awkward with 99 Quote
11-04-2008 , 03:47 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by ManChild
why couldn't he have a flush here?

are there no suited connector or suited ace type hands in his range PF?
i would expect a flush draw to bet this flop. is that an incorrect assumption?
awkward with 99 Quote
11-04-2008 , 05:32 AM
turn is bad because he can vbet/bluff a really balanced range since you both checked twice and basically turned both your hands faceup as crap.

preflop is bad because 99 is extraordinarily difficult to play 3way w/ bad relative position, and SB is likely not messing around that often preflop given you're UTG and he's oop.

all of that being said, i like your reasoning for calling the river: the rest of the hand is butchered bad, but calling the river appears to be profitable to me.
awkward with 99 Quote
11-04-2008 , 05:40 AM
he can easily go for a c/r on this flop with a flush draw like AQhh or JQhh. I hate every street of this hand. People are just not messing around enough from the SB to utg to justify calling with 99. Even if I told you that he does this with AK, AQ, 1010 and air it would be difficult to turn a profit post flop this shallow multiway with as mythril said bad relative position. If he is messing around that bad, you have to be worried about the cold caller who could be trapping a habitual squeezer.

Once you hit that flop just never put any more money in without it going 99.
awkward with 99 Quote
11-04-2008 , 01:28 PM
i agree pf was a mistake. btn is repping such a narrow range on the turn. i dont really see why we have to put him on a set and autofold. even if he's betting a jack, he's probably not betting the jack on the river.

Quote:
Originally Posted by irockhoess
he can easily go for a c/r on this flop with a flush draw like AQhh or JQhh.
huh? sb?
awkward with 99 Quote
11-04-2008 , 01:32 PM
I would donk the turn. As played I can see a river call
awkward with 99 Quote
11-04-2008 , 04:03 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by $upermad4it
I would donk the turn. As played I can see a river call
If we're donking turn we should be shoving any non heart river, though I think this is almost as bad as c/cing the turn.

As played I guess we have to call any river with the given pot odds, but villain would have to be pretty bad for us to be good a decent amount of the time. He should know that we know that he does not have a king, so I prefer just folding the turn.

And yeah, I don't like preflop call very much either.
awkward with 99 Quote
11-04-2008 , 06:29 PM
i think preflop is fine. flop obv fine. turn is reasonably close. i guess folding is a bit better than calling. river is clear fold.

as for the preflop, we don't want to let the villain get HU with the loose fish. also, if we think the fish is likely calling behind us, we have great implied odds on a set.
awkward with 99 Quote
11-04-2008 , 06:34 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by schwza
i think preflop is fine. flop obv fine. turn is reasonably close. i guess folding is a bit better than calling. river is clear fold.
You do realize we're getting 3 to 1 on the river shove? I can't imagine we're not going to be good at least 1 in 4 times here considering his range is extremely isolated. If we're calling the turn under suspicion that BTN might be full of it, I'm pretty sure calling any river is going to be profitable.

I still fold turn, though.
awkward with 99 Quote
11-05-2008 , 03:23 AM
ya fold turn or call river
awkward with 99 Quote
11-05-2008 , 02:19 PM
I would fold pre.

But i do think that BTN can valuebet a J on the river here, so its not that he has a flush, set or nothing there. Our hand is really at best AJ or QQ but still doesnt seem that likely.
awkward with 99 Quote
11-05-2008 , 05:04 PM
fold turn even if it's slightly +ev because that river spot is always going to be gross. also, he could definately have checked back hearts on that flop
awkward with 99 Quote
11-06-2008 , 04:05 AM
just fold pre most of the time
awkward with 99 Quote

      
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