50nl: Value or shove??? - Micro Stakes Pot Limit and No Limit

Two Plus Two Forums Poker Strategy Online No-Limit Hold’em Cash

50nl: Value or shove???

Post Reply Subscribe

...

04-11-2011 , 03:59 AM

Reap911

enthusiast

Join Date: Jan 2011 Posts: 76

villain is a 22/15 3bet 5% WWSF 38% fold to cbet 66% on flop, 31% on turn!

IPoker Network $50.00 No Limit Hold'em - 5 players - View hand 1272552
DeucesCracked Poker Videos Hand History Converter

SB: $54.24
BB: $52.25
Hero (UTG): $51.14
CO: $62.85
BTN: $53.61

Pre Flop: ($0.75) Hero is UTG with A

Hero raises to $1.75, CO calls $1.75, 1 fold, SB calls $1.50, 1 fold

Flop: ($5.75) 2

(3 players)
SB checks, Hero bets $3.50, CO calls $3.50, SB folds

Turn: ($12.75) K

(2 players)
Hero bets $8.00, CO calls $8

River: ($28.75) 3

(2 players)
[color=red]

Value or shove?

Quote

04-11-2011 , 06:17 AM

gateswi

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Feb 2009 Posts: 11,427

just v-bet like $22 imo

overshoving isn't bad this just seems like a spot where we really don't want to increase villain's fold % at all since he's liable to not call a river bet anyway on this board w/ Qx and possibly not even KQ

Quote

04-11-2011 , 06:23 AM

Take_Pills

centurion

Join Date: Nov 2010 Posts: 199

i think 22 is a bit much considering the sizing on previous streets as well as board texture. I'd go for something like 18 here. AQ is a big part of his range based on line/stats and we'd like to make a bet that he could call us with here.

Quote

04-11-2011 , 06:26 AM

Cosmic Baby

adept

Join Date: Nov 2009 Posts: 1,093

i bet 15 $ on the river, once he raises you can safely fold.

shoving is spew, only hands that have us beat will call.

Quote

04-11-2011 , 06:32 AM

ionutd

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Apr 2010 Posts: 13,624

17-18 or so

Quote

04-11-2011 , 06:44 AM

Icalludown

grinder

Join Date: Oct 2006 Posts: 427

Def V-bet here instead of shoving.

Quote

04-11-2011 , 07:38 AM

immadeadbird

veteran

Join Date: Mar 2010 Posts: 2,276

bet bigger on flop/turn. do you can shove riv PSB

edit: that is if you wanted a shove on riv.

actually i think you might find more vlaue w/ the line you took. not sure depends on villain

Quote

04-11-2011 , 07:41 AM

Im3rd

grinder

Join Date: Nov 2010 Posts: 577

around 20 is a call for him. since river is more or less a blank, i could see him calling w/ pretty medicore hands. Kx, Qx, lower PP.

Quote

04-11-2011 , 07:42 AM

Im3rd

grinder

Join Date: Nov 2010 Posts: 577

Quote:

Originally Posted by Icalludown

Def V-bet here instead of shoving.

if we shove for value is a value bet =)

Quote

04-11-2011 , 07:44 AM

#10

GingerViking

grinder

Join Date: Sep 2009 Posts: 528

Definitely shove, $40 into $30 pot isn't that much of an overbet. Wouldn't expect villain to call a Vbet with Qx, would expect a call either way with KQ, or Kx.

Quote

04-11-2011 , 10:09 AM

#11

vikingkong

veteran

Join Date: Sep 2009 Posts: 3,497

Turn can be bigger. Can't shove river on this board, bet std 3/4pot. Come on guys villain doesn't get to the river with Kx unless it's KQ.

Quote

04-12-2011 , 04:22 AM

#12

GingerViking

grinder

Join Date: Sep 2009 Posts: 528

Quote:

Originally Posted by vikingkong

Turn can be bigger. Can't shove river on this board, bet std 3/4pot. Come on guys villain doesn't get to the river with Kx unless it's KQ.

I am finding it hard to think of villains range in this spot other than KQ. What does a 22/18 with high fold to cbet get to this river with? Villain obviously has something but I can't think of anything other than KQ. Is 2x really in 22/18s preflop range? I would guess A2s?

Quote

04-12-2011 , 05:19 AM

#13

Falcone

old hand

Join Date: Aug 2010 Posts: 1,816

Quote:

Originally Posted by GingerViking

It's nice then that all A2s combo's are blocked.

Don't shove, bet somewhere between 15 and 20 to give him a decision with TT/JJ/AQ.

It's a beautiful board to double or triple barrel, which villain may realize and he might look you up lighter as a result.

Quote

04-12-2011 , 07:26 AM

#14

vikingkong

veteran

Join Date: Sep 2009 Posts: 3,497

AQ, QJ, maybe QTs, 22/15 is calling a decent amount somewhere pre flop. And occasionally suspicious regs will look you up with JJ/TT because zomg we can't bet a queen anymore.

He shouldn't ever have 2x.

Quote

04-12-2011 , 08:30 AM

#15

keane_mark2

adept

Join Date: Nov 2009 Posts: 846

bet 25$.

Quote

04-12-2011 , 08:55 AM

#16

pbowenroe

old hand

Join Date: Apr 2010 Posts: 1,831

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cosmic Baby

i bet 15 $ on the river, once he raises you can safely fold.

shoving is spew, only hands that have us beat will call.

How is this river a b/f? I can't think of any hand that beats us apart from 22, which is obv very unlikely.

Quote

04-12-2011 , 11:14 AM

#17

GingerViking

grinder

Join Date: Sep 2009 Posts: 528

This looks like a situation where its read dependent, so OP has to decide based on previous hands etc

Quote

04-12-2011 , 01:41 PM

#18

Durendal

journeyman

Join Date: Nov 2008 Posts: 234

Work on your betsizing so you can ship river.

Quote

04-12-2011 , 03:41 PM

#19

Alexander Young

veteran

Join Date: Aug 2010 Posts: 2,115

No reason to overbet unless you have an image where your opponent might believe that you have it in you to raise UTG, cbet into two opponents, barrel a turn, and then shove the river as a bluff.

If villain folds any hand to your river value bet you should be exploiting him mercilessly for the rest of the session btw.

Quote

04-12-2011 , 05:21 PM

#20

lumileijona

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Jul 2009 Posts: 8,020

way bigger on the flop. He isn't folding a pair- bet river close to pot, he is rarely folding a queen and KQ never.

Quote

Post Reply Subscribe

...