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50NL JQo BvB 50NL JQo BvB

11-06-2008 , 03:06 AM
Villain is pretty much unknown as I just sat down at table 15 hands ago. Didn't seem all to well with hands he was calling with from what I seen though. Ok I have position and decent hand so I raise him in position.

Flop is really dry so I bet pretty small... shoulda made it like 2.50 or 3 looking at it now dunno why I did 2. Turn is a no brainer bet I hit my over pair. Now villain insta check min raises me... wtf. I could get it in here whats in his range?? Possibly Q9,9x,air,set,JT. I decide to call and reevalute river.

River is a really bad card and I now pretty much beat just air... he bets 10 into 30 basically.. think this is profitable to snap off?

PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em, $0.50 BB (3 handed) - Poker-Stars Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com

Button ($26.70)
SB ($29.60)
Hero (BB) ($74.20)

Preflop: Hero is BB with Q, J
1 fold, SB calls $0.25, Hero raises to $2, SB calls $1.50

Flop: ($4) 2, 9, 7 (2 players)
SB checks, Hero bets $2, SB calls $2

Turn: ($8) Q (2 players)
SB checks, Hero bets $5, SB raises to $10, Hero calls $5

River: ($28) 9 (2 players)
SB bets $10, hero ???
50NL JQo BvB Quote
11-06-2008 , 03:11 AM
he isn't check raising the turn with a random nine so the river doesn't scare me. I call river (or fold turn if you dont want to), if he limp/called KQ then make a note. if he has a set or 97 make a note that he min check raises strong hands.
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11-06-2008 , 03:23 AM
bad flop to cbet imo
i think i fold turn to min raise
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11-06-2008 , 03:40 AM
don't think river changes anything from the turn. if you call turn, river is a call
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11-06-2008 , 03:41 AM
Villain showed up with A9 on river.. weird line from him
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11-06-2008 , 03:43 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ksight3
bad flop to cbet imo
i think i fold turn to min raise
Dun see why its a bad flop to C-bet.. its rainbow and doesnt really hit a whole lot. Please enlighten me I am trying to improve my C-bet skills as well
50NL JQo BvB Quote
11-06-2008 , 03:52 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by dtat0529
don't think river changes anything from the turn. if you call turn, river is a call
Why doesn't the river change anything? The 9 pairing might scare a fish off but instead he just keeps firing - this should tell us a pair of queen with a jack kicker is pretty weak in this spot. I don't think he's bluffing.

I don't like the cbet or the sizing. I like checking back the flop and betting the turn if he checks again. Betting 1/2 pot I think he's peeling the flop with a very big range.
50NL JQo BvB Quote
11-06-2008 , 03:54 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by daveh07
Dun see why its a bad flop to C-bet.. its rainbow and doesnt really hit a whole lot. Please enlighten me I am trying to improve my C-bet skills as well
His limp calling range includes a lot of 85 86 87 T8, just all the low connector cards which connect with 97x flop. Also villain won't fold A3 to a 1/2 pot bet.
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11-06-2008 , 04:06 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by JsTs
His limp calling range includes a lot of 85 86 87 T8, just all the low connector cards which connect with 97x flop. Also villain won't fold A3 to a 1/2 pot bet.
never really thought of it that way.. makes sense
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11-06-2008 , 07:45 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by daveh07
Dun see why its a bad flop to C-bet.. its rainbow and doesnt really hit a whole lot. Please enlighten me I am trying to improve my C-bet skills as well
bc connectors are in his range and also he knows you probably haven't hit on this flop so he could c/r you as a bluff.

Check behind the flop and bet any T or high card on the turn.

As played I like your line on the turn and I'll call the river.
50NL JQo BvB Quote
11-06-2008 , 08:22 AM
Flop cbet is not needed. On the turn, fold to the CR, your rarely ahead here. On the river Id call as its a blocking bet type size so it looks like hes somewhat scared
50NL JQo BvB Quote
11-06-2008 , 08:34 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by daveh07
Villain is pretty much unknown as I just sat down at table 15 hands ago. Didn't seem all to well with hands he was calling with from what I seen though. Ok I have position and decent hand so I raise him in position.

Flop is really dry so I bet pretty small... shoulda made it like 2.50 or 3 looking at it now dunno why I did 2. Turn is a no brainer bet I hit my over pair. Now villain insta check min raises me... wtf. I could get it in here whats in his range?? Possibly Q9,9x,air,set,JT. I decide to call and reevalute river.

River is a really bad card and I now pretty much beat just air... he bets 10 into 30 basically.. think this is profitable to snap off?

PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em, $0.50 BB (3 handed) - Poker-Stars Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com

Button ($26.70)
SB ($29.60)
Hero (BB) ($74.20)

Preflop: Hero is BB with Q, J
1 fold, SB calls $0.25, Hero raises to $2, SB calls $1.50

Flop: ($4) 2, 9, 7 (2 players)
SB checks, Hero bets $2, SB calls $2

Turn: ($8) Q (2 players)
SB checks, Hero bets $5, SB raises to $10, Hero calls $5

River: ($28) 9 (2 players)
SB bets $10, hero ???
Weird line, turn is definitely a call, not much he can rep with his c/r and you just made your lucky tp which he cannot expect. His range here is probably something like 9x, T8, 86, 97, 33-66, 88. River you lose now against all the 9x hands, but your getting 3-1 odds, and with so many hands in his range you do beat, and only needing to win this more than 25% of times to be profitable, it's a crying call and a big note on that guy
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11-06-2008 , 08:53 AM
you should cbet more like 3$ ,on turn like 6.5$ and fold the minraise.
this betsizing makes it easier to fold turn imo.
when u call that minraise ur drawing to 5 outs against 2pairs/tp/overpairs and dead against sets.
you rarely beat worst Qs.
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11-06-2008 , 08:57 AM
I would check the turn through, there are very few draws you need to protect against (86 T8) - you have a weak made hand wwith good showdown value but you dont want a big pot, you wont get anymore value from 9x 88 type hands but you will on the river if you check, and finally you dont want to be check raised off of a hand with good showdown value (turn c/r should usually be a fold here). There are a lot of rivers that help his range dramatically so youre just gonna have to pay off if he leads. But its better to play a 35bb pot with TPWK than a 100bb pot.
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11-06-2008 , 12:39 PM
First of all, new players who sit down for 60bb love to fight back and I really don't love raising PF here. Flame away, but at least initially, I keep pots small against these guys when I can. If he has Qx, I'm getting paid a decent amount as it is if a Q flops.

The flop is icky. Limp / call lines are just bad to c-bet against from these newbs with 30bb, IMO. I see this night after ****ing night - once a newb sits in and takes this line preflop, he hardly ever goes anywhere postflop. Great if you hit, sucks most of the time when you miss with a JQ, KJ type hand. Anyway, if you are going to c-bet, make it to $3. I don't mind a c-bet here, obviously, but just sayin'.

On the turn, bet more than half the pot, as you have the best hand a good chunk of the time. Make him pay for his 9 or his 7. I'd say bet 6 or 7. If you are going to bet 5, you just put yourself in ugly spots when he minraises like this, deciding whether to shove for value, call to re-evaluate, blah blah. If you bet 8, and he minraises, you happly get it in and force him into a bigger mistake.

The river is close, but I can't seem to get T8 or JT out of my head and probably call it off. For what its worth, he is putting his "cash night" life on the line with his stack, so, that may push things the other way. Just, there is something to be said in trying to get into the mind of these weak ass 60bb stacks. This is very much a value bet for him.

Last edited by BarryLyndon; 11-06-2008 at 12:40 PM. Reason: size of pot was 8, not 10, on the turn
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