First orbit or 2 at the table, so no reads or stats.
UTG+1: $51.15
MP1: $28.75
MP2: $12.80
CO: $49.25
Hero (BTN): $55.45
SB: $27.65
BB: $103.40
UTG: $8.50

Pre Flop: Hero is BTN with 8 8
4 folds, CO raises to $2, Hero calls $2, 2 folds

Flop: ($4.75) 7 6 3 (2 players)
CO bets $2, Hero calls $2

Turn: ($8.75) 8 (2 players)
CO bets $6.50, Hero raises to $15, CO calls $8.50

River: ($38.75) 5 (2 players)
CO checks, Hero checks

did i miss any value here?

Only a straight is going to call a shove on that board.

I'm not too sure about that. Villain's turn call suggest to me that he has a P+D, an overpair, 2pair, or perhaps a poorly played set. I think its unlikely that he made a straight though because there is more value in betting it then there is in checking, since I myself am not betting thinly.

Only 99 has a straight on that board, as played. I'm not saying you should shove, since I think that could cost you value as well, but you have to bet/call river. You're good here the majority of the time. This looks like an overpair, overcards w/flush draw, or possibly a weaker set/weaker pair with good kicker.

hmm, I think villain doesn't have str8, but it would be hard for him to call a value bet on the river without one.

WTF? If he doesn't have a straight, you have the nuts. Why would you check behind in that case?

I think the question should be, if you bet and he raises 3x, can you call?

If the answer is no, then check behind.

Because tbqh I don't trust my judgment fully in marginal situations like this one. I said "I think", not "I know", and like someone else mentioned, I'm not sure if AA or a lower set calls my shove.

Meh I play it the same. I may miss some value once and awhile but I think players at this level are so bad they can show up with anything.

The pot is $40, and villain has $30 behind, how much exactly are you planning on betting? I think the only plays here are check behind, b/c, or shove. A b/f certainly did not cross my mind.

SIDE NOTE: Jeanie, I fully approve of you new avatar

I think you're costing yourself a lot of money by checking behind in these spots. To me, this is seeing monsters under the bed. You might be able to extract a little more value out of an overpair, and you'll almost certainly get some more out of smaller sets/2 pair. Again, I don't like a shove here, because it forces these hands out.

What to do if you're check-raised is a good question, though. I initially advocated b/c, but I suppose b/f isn't bad either. I'd call most of the time, though.

I'd bet about 1/4 to 1/3 of the pot and call a shove.

Well first off you missed a boatload of value on your turn raise, unless you really think hes calling that light with hands like A7,A8,89 etc. You basically priced in a bunch of hands (flush draws, straight draws) that you wouldn't want to continue for almost free, also you don't gain tons of info about what he has because he WILL be calling really wide here in all likelihood, OR FOLDING, which true then you made a HUGE mistake in basically min raising here..

After he barrels again his range is still kinda wide as an unkown vs another unkown and I think this is a pretty good board to dbl on for him against you given the weak flop play, but anyways after he calls your turn raise I've gotta put him on 99+/9Jss+/A8/55 sometimes, A5 sometimes, 9Jo+ sometimes, and pretty rarely 2 pair connecting hands. The river basically never hits the low end of the straight and we don't know anything about how the villain plays a 9 here. We can assume hes likely to not bluff shove on top of us if we fire the river, and I think he calls a decent amount if we fire something like ~1/3psb at the end with 1010+ and even weaker pairs and 55 sometimes, even though its hard for him to put you on a hand that he beats that plays like this, but cuz its an unknown I think its worth the little valuebet at the end, but I don't think you lost THAT much value checking back

b/f is even worse than checking and missing value *sometimes*. On this board, is he really c/r with less than the nuts? If not, then check is the optimal line, not b/f.

Why is c/c the optimal line if he calls with 1010+ and 2 pair hands

I agree, the turn raise needs to be at least $20 - you're giving all those draws 3:1 to call.

We don't know his c/r range, which is why I would personally bet, cuss, and call. Just in my personal experience, I find that I've cost myself a lot more money by missing bets than by calling incorrectly, so I'm trying to adjust to that. Maybe this is the wrong spot for it.

But I still think we're good the vast majority of the time, and at these limits there are several worse hands that will call a small bet. 109 gets it in on turn, so I don't think he has that. It's either 99 or some suited hand with a 9 in it. There's a good chance all of these hands get it in on the turn as well. I like my hand in this spot enough to bet for value, so it's just a matter of how much you think he'll call.

But the point is, if you bet 1/3 of the pot for value and he RRAI, how much are you going to like your hand? Maybe I'm wrong here, but I will defend it.

Tum, I realize that my turn raise was very small, and I really don't know why as its something that I rarely do on a board like this. Anyways, you said that you're firing a 1/3psb. are you calling or folding to a CRAI?

I'm not disagreeing, if you are willing to call a shove, then you SHOULD valuebet thin...........

I think calling a c/r vs unknown would be incorrect and I could see a lot of reasons why he would take this line with a 9x/910

Like I said, I won't like my hand as much, but I'm still calling. I think you're absolutely right about the fact that checking behind can be optimal, but I don't think it is with these stack sizes. If they were deeper, then getting c/r out of a pot when you have a big hand is a disaster. Here, when villain has less than a PSB left, I think you're willing but not eager to get it in.

So are you in the bet/fold camp or the check behind camp? I could be completely, idiotically wrong here, but I just feel like checking behind is a mistake and folding to a relatively small c/r is a mistake. I also think you're getting c/r here very rarely, much less than you'll get called by worse.

ship it in, you'll get looked up

I double posted woops my bad

Well a 'relatively small' c/r is not existent in this spot. So if we fire $12 and he boosts to $30 I still think its perfectly fine to fold, and much better than calling.


bet fold >> check through >>>>> shove >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>bet call