500NL: Everything sucks- spot in 3bet pot - Micro Stakes Pot Limit and No Limit

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500NL: Everything sucks- spot in 3bet pot

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10-14-2010 , 12:32 PM

imfromsweden

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I'm running 28/26, haven't gotten too out of line.
Villain is 36/20, 36% ATS and 75% fold to 3bet. Is quite aggresive postflop.

I mean, betting is kinda meh since he's gonna float/bluffraise a ton. Check/calling sucks, because we're so easily gonna get blown off our hand. And check/folding sucks for obvious reasons.

iPoker - £5 NL - Holdem - 4 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 3

BTN: £456.57
Hero (INVALID POS): £521.65
SB: £167.90
UTG: £275.93

Hero posts SB £2.00, SB posts BB £5.00

Pre Flop: (pot: £7.00) Hero has K

fold, BTN raises to £15.00, Hero raises to £50.00, fold, BTN calls £35.00

Flop: (£105.00, 2 players) 9

Hero bets or not?

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10-14-2010 , 12:41 PM

_irock

old hand

Join Date: Nov 2007 Posts: 1,887

chk shove

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10-14-2010 , 12:45 PM

Imaginary F(r)iend

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Join Date: Jun 2008 Posts: 3,262

Why check/folding sucks? That's what I would do.

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10-14-2010 , 12:46 PM

RollinHand

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I don't really hate betting $65 and getting it in if he raises. You are going to have decent equity vs a range of 78,J8,QJ,KQ,AT etc.

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10-14-2010 , 12:48 PM

54-

banned

Join Date: Sep 2008 Posts: 876

Out of your choices i think c/c is worst.
I think folding is next worst, but only slightly worse than betting.
I probably bet like 60 and fold to a raise. Yea we get bluffraised some % of the time, but i don't think we are bet/folding this type of board that often to make it exploitable. If he calls, i think i'm double barreling like little over half on a lot of turns.

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10-14-2010 , 12:54 PM

babaar

old hand

Join Date: Feb 2008 Posts: 1,650

Quote:

Originally Posted by irockhoess

chk shove

please could you elaborate why?

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10-14-2010 , 12:57 PM

RollinHand

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Quote:

75% fold to 3bet

Oops, missed that part, maybe irock did too?

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10-14-2010 , 01:03 PM

$upermad4it

Pooh-Bah

Join Date: Mar 2006 Posts: 5,275

check shove probably the worst option. c/c is fine as is betting. All depends on your overall gameplan

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10-14-2010 , 01:29 PM

_irock

old hand

Join Date: Nov 2007 Posts: 1,887

I mean if he doesn't want to do any of the other options, c/shoving is his last option so it was more of just a completion of listing the options.

With someone with a 3bet/fold that high I would have to know if that 25% hes defending is more QJ type hands or 44 type hands before I would choose an option.

I also think OP is looking at every option pessimistically. I don't expect to get outplayed by his range a ton on this board. Knowing villain's 4betting percentage would also be essential.

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10-14-2010 , 01:37 PM

#10

imfromsweden

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Quote:

Originally Posted by irockhoess

I don't have enough hands/don't pay enough attention to know what hands he defends with. Prolly just standard hands to defend with.

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10-14-2010 , 02:11 PM

#11

BuddhaMonk187

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Join Date: Mar 2008 Posts: 4,475

why does c/f'ing suck?
so many better hands in your range to continue and his range is not that wide

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10-14-2010 , 02:35 PM

#12

JackalMegalomaniac

centurion

Join Date: May 2009 Posts: 142

because its quite likely that we are up against a range like this if we check and he bets:

Board: Th 9d 9s
Dead:

equity win tie pots won pots tied
Hand 0: 55.298% 54.91% 00.39% 35332 252.50 { AA, JJ-99, ATs, KTs+, QTs+, JTs, T9s, KJo+, QJo }
Hand 1: 44.702% 44.31% 00.39% 28513 252.50 { AsKh }

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10-14-2010 , 02:40 PM

#13

pgcounty

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Join Date: Jan 2008 Posts: 3,183

Quote:

Originally Posted by imfromsweden

betting is kinda meh
Check/calling sucks
check/folding sucks

"kinda meh" is much better than "sucks"

seems like you already have your answer

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10-15-2010 , 12:17 AM

#14

ITSOVER9000

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Join Date: Apr 2008 Posts: 3,254

c/shove is likely +ev but not optimal, i don't know why people are saying c/c sucks.

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10-19-2010 , 09:14 AM

#15

pokerslap

centurion

Join Date: Apr 2009 Posts: 190

raise shove to a reraise if you have a tight image.
you can only do with with the right image
if you get caught dont do it again in the next 500 hands

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10-19-2010 , 10:51 AM

#16

MoLoToV

grinder

Join Date: Nov 2007 Posts: 422

Quote:

Originally Posted by ITSOVER9000

c/shove is likely +ev but not optimal, i don't know why people are saying c/c sucks.

the ones that do clearly don't have balanced cc ranges in 3b pots.
"ill get pushed off my hand etc".
there are so many spots in this forum that are clear cc spots in my mind where alot of posters hate it.

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10-19-2010 , 10:59 AM

#17

imfromsweden

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Even if we're balanced, if he's a reg without much history, he's not gonna know how balanced we are when we c/c flops in 3bet pots and is just gonna assume we're unbalanced.

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10-19-2010 , 11:19 AM

#18

GSWarriors

grinder

Join Date: Apr 2009 Posts: 655

You titled this thread correctly. Everything you usually do sucks. Find a new game imo OP

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10-19-2010 , 11:40 AM

#19

babaar

old hand

Join Date: Feb 2008 Posts: 1,650

Is it possible to some how ban the guy above? He does nothing but troll.

Depending on the player i see c/f c/c or b/f all being pretty decent options.
Looks like a c/f or c/c here from the info you've given.

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10-19-2010 , 11:59 AM

#20

GSWarriors

grinder

Join Date: Apr 2009 Posts: 655

id gladly take your bankroll in a hu match babaar

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10-19-2010 , 12:13 PM

#21

RollinHand

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Quote:

Is it possible to some how ban the guy above? He does nothing but troll.

Click this button

and report him to the mods and he will be banned shortly

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10-19-2010 , 12:18 PM

#22

babaar

old hand

Join Date: Feb 2008 Posts: 1,650

Quote:

Originally Posted by GSWarriors

id gladly take your bankroll in a hu match babaar

Thats very kind of you. Do you want to compare willys too?

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10-19-2010 , 12:20 PM

#23

Barewire

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Quote:

Originally Posted by imfromsweden

Even if we're balanced, if he's a reg without much history, he's not gonna know how balanced we are when we c/c flops in 3bet pots and is just gonna assume we're unbalanced.

so he'll be wrong then

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10-19-2010 , 12:25 PM

#24

imfromsweden

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Quote:

Originally Posted by Barewire

so he'll be wrong then

Yeah... but not this time.

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10-19-2010 , 01:10 PM

#25

jackwilcox

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if you think he is bluff raising a ton/ raising QJ/KQ type hands, i dont see why bet/call or bet/shove is a bad option at all.

check/shove is also probably +ev but hard to see it being better than betting. check/call i dont think is clear, or a good option, i feel like a lot of people will put us on AK/AQ type of hand.

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