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50 NL 33 Line Check vs Tight Aggressive 50 NL 33 Line Check vs Tight Aggressive

02-22-2018 , 01:39 PM
50 NL $0.25/$0.50 6 max

Villain BB ($113): Tight, has only shown AKs I'd put him at 20/15 so far

Me Btn ($50): I've also been playing tight as well and haven't shown any cards. I was a bit more aggressive so I'd put my range at around 25/20.

I have 3h3c

Preflop

Everyone folds to me and I raise to $1.50 on the Btn with 3h3c
SB folds, BB calls $1.50

Flop ($3.09): 6c Jh 2d

Villain checks, I check

Turn ($3.09): 6c Jh 2d 6h

Villain bets $2.12, I fold

-------------

Possible hands from villain

AK-AT, KQ-KJ, QJ, JT, 22-AA, T9s-65s, A9s-A6s

Obviously lots of jacks in his range and some Ace high, most of his pairs beat me

Correct fold?
50 NL 33 Line Check vs Tight Aggressive Quote
02-22-2018 , 01:56 PM
Bet flop. Third to half pot. You usually have the best hand on a dry flop like this. As played, unless you know villain is capable of driving draws, turn is fold.

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50 NL 33 Line Check vs Tight Aggressive Quote
02-22-2018 , 03:05 PM
This is a good spot to bet your whole range. This is because you have a strong range advantage and also a positional advantage, making it possible to bet your whole profitably. Your opponnent cannot make this unprofitable while remaining balanced himself. You dont want to have a checking range here since this checkingrange :

1. would be very obvious and exploitative
2. benefits from protection
50 NL 33 Line Check vs Tight Aggressive Quote
02-22-2018 , 03:20 PM
Thanks guys. Wouldn't a bet on the Flop be seen as a bluff catcher though? I mean if I really had something wouldn't a check be the best play on this dry board? Why bet if I had top pair or pocket pair. His range also beats mine since he was playing very nitty.

What do you guys think of a check raise on the turn instead?
50 NL 33 Line Check vs Tight Aggressive Quote
02-22-2018 , 03:37 PM
Not sure I follow, how can a bet be a bluffcatcher? Bluffcatching means calling, its a passive action not an agressive one.

"I mean if I really had something wouldn't a check be the best play on this dry board?"

Not really since your range when opening on the button has a lot of air in it and on a board where your opponnent is unlikely to connect, your air wants to bet. Since air is a huge part of your range, that means that your range wants to bluff. Its important to balance your bluffs when you have so many of them. When you X your strong hands, it means you can't be bluffing (or at least if you do, youre extremely unbalanced)
His range doesnt really beat you, even if he is playing nitty, you have JJ-AA where he doesnt, so you have a range advantage. He still has a lot of broadways that miss this flop and also could have SC
50 NL 33 Line Check vs Tight Aggressive Quote
02-22-2018 , 03:40 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by jimmyb23

What do you guys think of a check raise on the turn instead?
How can you XR when youre in position? Im again not sure if I follow. Im not trying to be mean or anything I just want to understand you
50 NL 33 Line Check vs Tight Aggressive Quote
02-22-2018 , 04:21 PM
We have to be betting this flop with 100% of our range imo. I agree with everything said above.
50 NL 33 Line Check vs Tight Aggressive Quote
02-22-2018 , 04:52 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Andy Art
This is a good spot to bet your whole range. This is because you have a strong range advantage and also a positional advantage, making it possible to bet your whole profitably. Your opponnent cannot make this unprofitable while remaining balanced himself. You dont want to have a checking range here since this checkingrange :

1. would be very obvious and exploitative
2. benefits from protection
Thanks. Disregard what I said before. I thought I was OOP when I looked at it again. Not feeling too well this morning so my heads not straight

What do you mean by 2. benefits from protection?

Now that I see it it does make sense to bet the flop. Hypothetically, if he were to check-raise me on the flop how can I read whether he's bluffing or actually has a Jack or a set? What would you do in this situation vs this type of opponent?
50 NL 33 Line Check vs Tight Aggressive Quote
02-22-2018 , 05:05 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by jimmyb23

What do you mean by 2. benefits from protection?
I mean that your showdownvalue hand will get outdrawn when you check them, for example lets say your opponnent has 98. If you bet a showdownvaluehand like 33, he likely folds his 98 (lets assume he has no BD, FD or anything that makes floating a good idea). When he folds, he will fold 6 outs, meaning he gives up 24% equity against your particular hand. If you X, you will let your opponnent realise this equity against you. Thats not always a bad thing, sometimes Checking is simply the best play. But not here for all the reasons mentioned.

Betting made hands to deny your opponnent his equity is called betting for protection. It is not (necessarily) the same as a value bet. And your showdownvalue hands benefit from such a protection bet.
50 NL 33 Line Check vs Tight Aggressive Quote
02-22-2018 , 05:19 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by jimmyb23
Hypothetically, if he were to check-raise me on the flop how can I read whether he's bluffing or actually has a Jack or a set? What would you do in this situation vs this type of opponent?
This is a board where its not really good to have a Checkraising range. So when your opponnent does checkraise, in my opinion that means he is likely not a good player. Its hard to "read" whether he is bluffing when you have little information. You have to pay attention to the frequencys of your opponnents check-raises here or see him go to showdown, hopefully this will give you an idea of how he is playing.

Until you have this information, in this very spot, you should assume your opponnent to be unbalanced towards bluffs in my opinion. This is due to the dynamics of the situation:

1. You are opening in late position and betting on a dry flop, your perceived range is therefor weak
2. Your opponnent can have a wide range flatting in the BB
3. Your opponnent has a very narrow value range. A set of two's and sixes is 6 combos total and he does not have a set of Jacks since he likely 3bets those. Many players dont raise Jx here, but even if we think our opponnent raises KJ and AJ, those are only 24 combos and he may 3bet AJ preflop
4. He is Check-raising you. This is a board where a good player would not be Check-raising you. When someone does something that a good player would not do, its likely that he is unbalanced in some way. Given the dynamics I think he is unbalanced towards bluffs.

Given all that, you want to defend enough of your range to make it harder for villian to bluff profitably. You can do this by floating with Flushdraws and strong back door draws. Those hands can give you the equity to fight back while also having implied odds.

Last edited by Andy Art; 02-22-2018 at 05:22 PM. Reason: Clarity
50 NL 33 Line Check vs Tight Aggressive Quote
02-23-2018 , 12:04 PM
I would bet flop, but I'm not really on board with not having a checking range. A Jxx flop isn't that good for our range vs. a BB defending range, so I think checking back some amount of hands is reasonable. We're not ever checking A6? TT-77? Our weakest Jx's? Ace high?
50 NL 33 Line Check vs Tight Aggressive Quote
02-23-2018 , 12:19 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by JamesBJames
I would bet flop, but I'm not really on board with not having a checking range. A Jxx flop isn't that good for our range vs. a BB defending range, so I think checking back some amount of hands is reasonable. We're not ever checking A6? TT-77? Our weakest Jx's? Ace high?
All those hands to fine with betting when we use a small betsize like 1/3-1/2 Pot imo. Why would we wanna X A6 but bet 33?
50 NL 33 Line Check vs Tight Aggressive Quote

      
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