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4nl Blind v Blind Flop Top 2 Pair 4nl Blind v Blind Flop Top 2 Pair

08-15-2014 , 10:36 PM
So, the lesson of the day for me today is value shoving. Through watching other players and then doing a lot of reading/studying throughout the day in between playing, I started to shove a little bit more today. I was doing it far too little and really had no idea as to when it was a profitable, +EV move.

How about this one? When I saw what he had left after his turn bet I realized that if I was going to call that bet, I might as well shove since I'm not going to fold to the remaining $1.30 or so on the river. Also, with villain's stats I just auto concluded "fish" and shoved. In the end I got a great read on villain though since he was running @ 10/0/0 and only will play 10% and proceed past the flop if he flops the nuts. Crazy, but that's apparently his thing.

Revolution Gaming Network - $0.04 NL (6 max) - Holdem - 6 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 4

UTG: $4.63 (VPIP: 33.95, PFR: 23.83, 3Bet Preflop: 6.25, Hands: 223)
MP: $9.89 (VPIP: 17.04, PFR: 11.48, 3Bet Preflop: 3.28, Hands: 586)
CO: $5.23 (VPIP: 14.60, PFR: 11.17, 3Bet Preflop: 3.45, Hands: 411)
BTN: $1.94 (VPIP: 27.27, PFR: 18.18, 3Bet Preflop: 0.00, Hands: 12)
SB: $3.32 (VPIP: 6.67, PFR: 0.00, 3Bet Preflop: 0.00, Hands: 45)
Hero (BB): $12.63

SB posts SB $0.02, Hero posts BB $0.04

Pre Flop: (pot: $0.06) Hero has K J

fold, fold, fold, BTN calls $0.04, SB calls $0.02, Hero raises to $0.12, fold, SB calls $0.08

Flop: ($0.28, 2 players) K J 9
SB checks, Hero bets $0.19, SB calls $0.19

Turn: ($0.66, 2 players) 3
SB checks, Hero bets $0.66, SB raises to $1.65, Hero raises to $12.32 and is all-in, SB calls $1.36 and is all-in

River: ($6.68, 2 players) 4

Spoiler:
SB shows T Q (Straight, King High) (Pre 38%, Flop 82%, Turn 91%)
Hero shows K J (Two Pair, Kings and Jacks) (Pre 62%, Flop 18%, Turn 9%)
SB wins $6.24
4nl Blind v Blind Flop Top 2 Pair Quote
08-16-2014 , 12:53 AM
prefer 4x pre. value vs fish and put the "reg" in tougher spot with his limp.
I don't think this guy is really a fish. Nitfish if any
download equilab if you haven't already. put his range on it. K9 J9 KJ QT and see if you have enough equity to shove.
4nl Blind v Blind Flop Top 2 Pair Quote
08-16-2014 , 01:42 AM
I don't like the preflop raise. With SBs super nit stats he probably only holding very good hands that have you dominated and is probably always calling 3bet, because again he's only holding strong hands. And you are OOP.

I think you're good here usually. If in position I'd say just call turn to give him another chance to bet river since you're calling all rivers. But since you are OOP, gotta raise it here can't risk him checking back on river.
4nl Blind v Blind Flop Top 2 Pair Quote
08-16-2014 , 02:03 AM
I won't lie I looked at the result before posting (hate that spoiler box), but I did also scream he had the straight as I looked at the hand.

Pre-flop. Don't 3bet a nit this tight on his first pre-flop raise. No good will come from it generally.

Flop. Fine.

Turn. When he c/r here on a total blank it screams massive strength from a passive nit. Set, 2-pair I'd think he raises on flop due to the board being so super wet.

Still difficult to get away from and short of a diamond on river it was all going in there if not the turn. Don't have issue with the shove, but I'd like to think sometimes my jedi powers make me fold. Can't see it too often though. lol
4nl Blind v Blind Flop Top 2 Pair Quote
08-16-2014 , 02:40 AM
Don't think potting the turn is good vs nit. Vs fish is fine for value but i would just bet a standard amount vs this guy and i think fold to the raise? It's hard to be unbiased in my thinking tho since you posted spoilers and i cant stop myself from clicking it.
4nl Blind v Blind Flop Top 2 Pair Quote
08-16-2014 , 08:48 AM
Thanks for the replies, guys. In the future I'll leave things at "hero???" instead of tagging the spoiler on the bottom. I'll be the first to admit that it is a little hard to not peak first.

I finally got a few hours of sleep last night but it's nice to wake up and see this thread. If I could do the hand over obviously I would fold to this reraise but it's nice to see that I wasn't totally off base here with my thinking and planning for the hand.

The other thing that happened was that after several days of just break even, break even, break even on that network (constantly drawing to the nuts and never hitting anything) I had just gone on a huge run. I was down $8 at one point yesterday and brought it back to $7.50 up in 40 minutes. Yes, $15.50 in 40 minutes. I must have stacked four guys. By the time we got to this hand I had a huge stack and looked and saw $1.00 and change left in his stack on the turn and was like "jam".

At least I'm progressing and advancing my understanding. Something really clicked yesterday between the 2,200 hands I played and all of the studying that I did. I was literally one player yesterday morning and another entirely by the evening. I was only ever considering jamming when I had the nuts previously and I finally figured out that this is where I'm missing all of the big value in my sessions.

Last edited by Rapala88; 08-16-2014 at 08:57 AM.
4nl Blind v Blind Flop Top 2 Pair Quote
08-16-2014 , 09:43 AM
This would be a fine line against a more aggressive player but vs this guy I'd bet smaller on the turn and fold to a raise.
4nl Blind v Blind Flop Top 2 Pair Quote
08-16-2014 , 10:25 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by thetallpaul
This would be a fine line against a more aggressive player but vs this guy I'd bet smaller on the turn and fold to a raise.
This is how I would handle it. The fact is that I was so focused on my top 2 and that I had a fish with 25% of my stack sitting there on an action flop that I flat out didn't even see the straight on the board.

Revolution doesn't have a little line on the bottom of the screen that tells you what your hand is. You are left entirely to read the board on your own. This is good for me though because it's naturally making me a better board reader. Still, I make mistakes now and then and this was one of them.

All of that aside - in the moment itself, even if I had seen the chance he had the straight, I would have shoved over him. I have him tagged and noted a this point though so for $3.22 there who knows how much it will save me in the future. I'll just keep firing bullets at this guy until he shows some sort of aggression and then lay it down in the future.
4nl Blind v Blind Flop Top 2 Pair Quote

      
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