4bet pot, bluffing with ATo - Micro Stakes Pot Limit and No Limit

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4bet pot, bluffing with ATo

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01-20-2020 , 01:54 PM

MyDogIsOnTheRoof

centurion

Join Date: Feb 2017 Posts: 118

PokerStars - $0.16 NL FAST (6 max) - Holdem - 6 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 4

Hero (BTN): $20.65
SB: $27.38
BB: $16.00
UTG: $56.96
MP: $26.50
CO: $14.41

SB posts SB $0.08, BB posts BB $0.16

Pre Flop: (pot: $0.24) Hero has A

fold, fold, fold, Hero raises to $0.40, SB raises to $1.44, fold, Hero raises to $3.52, SB calls $2.08

Flop: ($7.20, 2 players) Q

SB checks, Hero bets $2.06, SB calls $2.06

Turn: ($11.32, 2 players) 5

SB checks, Hero bets $4.96, SB calls $4.96

River: ($21.24, 2 players) 8

SB checks, Hero bets $10.11 and is all-in, fold

Hero wins $20.28

Do you think it's +EV to bluff the river here. I would prefere to have a diamond, but atleast I block the straight and I have no showdown value. Also If I do not bluff this hand, it feels like I have no bluffs here. It is also very hard to know what range to give Villain, I think it varies a lot.

Last edited by MyDogIsOnTheRoof; 01-20-2020 at 02:00 PM.

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01-20-2020 , 02:36 PM

bailashtoreth

veteran

Join Date: Sep 2014 Posts: 2,326

ATo is not a 4b.

You have no

blockers; I don't think it's a great bluff spot.

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01-20-2020 , 02:54 PM

MyDogIsOnTheRoof

centurion

Join Date: Feb 2017 Posts: 118

Quote:

Originally Posted by bailashtoreth

ATo is not a 4b.

You have no

blockers; I don't think it's a great bluff spot.

Yes it is, about 30% according to preflop rangers generated by solvers.

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01-20-2020 , 03:49 PM

bailashtoreth

veteran

Join Date: Sep 2014 Posts: 2,326

1. You have to make assumptions about SB's 3b range to determine that it's 30%.

2. Against my SB 3b range, ATo is 47% hot and cold. That's not a hand i want to 4b.

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01-20-2020 , 06:31 PM

D-Beat

banned

Join Date: Mar 2018 Posts: 3,009

Not enough in the pot to riverbluff.

And AT is too strong to 4b. I think your 4b ranges are too wide if you're doing this from time to time.

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01-20-2020 , 07:31 PM

andreicos

old hand

Join Date: May 2019 Posts: 1,250

I think it's not a great flop for you, he might flat some JT, he's 99, KQs; but we've some strong hands too and AT is a good bluff.

yeah it's tough to put V on ranges in 4b pots; what range do you use here though ? I if I had A4o I'd rather bluff that ott.

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01-20-2020 , 07:44 PM

amazin lazer

old hand

Join Date: Aug 2017 Posts: 1,905

KJo / ATo are my highest frequency 4! bluffs in this confrontation, which is from solved ranges, pre is completely fine. They are good blocker hands, and can encourage better hands / equity hands to fold.

for combo selection, we will have some weaker Ax suited hands, but this hand specifically blocks AA / AK / AQ / TJ

barrel off on river would be much better with diamond combos of AT, but nice line / follow through.

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01-20-2020 , 08:21 PM

amazin lazer

old hand

Join Date: Aug 2017 Posts: 1,905

Quote:

Originally Posted by MyDogIsOnTheRoof

. Also If I do not bluff this hand, it feels like I have no bluffs here. It is also very hard to know what range to give Villain, I think it varies a lot.

you still have your diamond ATo combos and some weak suited Ax which should be barreled off sometimes. As far as ranging villain, I just look at optimal, you're supposed to 4 bet aggressively with a range polar in character, and villain is supposed to defend a condensed range with a lot of suited broadway Ax / Kx medium pairs JJ-> mixing some SC / AA sometimes.

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01-20-2020 , 08:24 PM

whitemares

Pooh-Bah

Join Date: Nov 2014 Posts: 5,786

Quote:

Originally Posted by D-Beat

Not enough in the pot to riverbluff.

What? The pot is already 2x the effective stack size, you can't get much bigger than that

Quote:

Originally Posted by D-Beat

And AT is too strong to 4b. I think your 4b ranges are too wide if you're doing this from time to time.

Offsuit hands are usually terrible in 3b pots, so even if you are calling ATo, it'd be the absolute bottom of your calling range in virtually any scenario

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01-20-2020 , 09:57 PM

#10

D-Beat

banned

Join Date: Mar 2018 Posts: 3,009

Quote:

Originally Posted by whitemares

What? The pot is already 2x the effective stack size, you can't get much bigger than that

Offsuit hands are usually terrible in 3b pots, so even if you are calling ATo, it'd be the absolute bottom of your calling range in virtually any scenario

Sounds like a valueshove... Probably right on pf.

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01-21-2020 , 12:13 AM

#11

bailashtoreth

veteran

Join Date: Sep 2014 Posts: 2,326

Quote:

Originally Posted by D-Beat

And AT is too strong to 4b. I think your 4b ranges are too wide if you're doing this from time to time.

That was exactly my point. It's not a value 4b and it's too strong to fold. Why do we want to bloat the pot against a strong range?

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01-21-2020 , 01:20 AM

#12

nonsimplesimon

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Feb 2009 Posts: 10,141

Pre is fine.

I hate that flop though. Probably checking there.

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01-21-2020 , 01:30 AM

#13

yasuo

veteran

Join Date: Feb 2014 Posts: 2,147

I think population would lead his flushes a lot otr so he is capped when he checks river. I like the river bluff

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