He's been kind of active, either way it's an easy 4-bet. Does anyone raise more to make it close to a pot-sized shove if he calls it? Flop nails his range and I can't think of too many hands I'm getting to fold. I have to call turn, right?

Full Tilt Poker, $2/$4 NL Hold'em Cash Game, 2 Players
LeggoPoker.com - Hand History Converter

BB: $389.60
Hero (SB): $407

Pre-Flop: K A dealt to Hero (SB)
Hero raises to $12, BB raises to $36, Hero raises to $108, BB calls $72

Flop: ($216) T J 5 (2 Players)
BB checks, Hero checks

Turn: ($216) A (2 Players)
BB bets $281.60 and is All-In, Hero calls $281.60

Well it depends on his range for flating your 4bet, if he's a PeopleMover who can show up with 95o I snap the river hehe, otherwise your toast alot

um tough spot, i think you need to call though, but i'm use to sng so i am not use to be being 100 deep

lol, this is awesome, you're my new favorite.

i bet the flop and get it in, you got straight draw and overs yo!

I bet flop. (I actually overbet shove flop)

$125ish pre is better.

- he can be anger shoving QQ mebbe.. your hand is a bit face up tbh, that said, he can have AQ a bit, and be trying to get it in with outs...

- preflop sizing makes this a pretty bad spot.

excuse me, but why would we want to make it a PSB on the flop with AK?

it seems to me having >PSB on the flop allows us a little room to maneuver and decreases the likelihood that villain will push the flop, allowing us to see a free card if we want it and still get it AI on 2 streets. The second next best option IMO is to raise enough PF to have us committed on the flop.

I sometimes check, sometimes bet. If I think he's the type to 4bet TT+ but call with all pairs and SCs then I'd bet, if he's been fairly tight in these spots then I'd just check and take the free card.

Your preflop raising size is perfect imo.

Turn is a must call, he could either a) be value-betting worse or b) bluffing/semi-bluffing. I think he shows up with hands like 89, QJ, KJ, Axs, complete air, etc, quite a bit here after you checked the flop.

the first part of your statement is bogus because any decent aggro player is going to shove over your half ass bet with air and make you fold.

The 2nd half of your statement is correct because you have to bet enough to show your villian you are not folding. By betting like 72.00 or whatever, you're begging to get shoved on because it looks like you are leaving yourself room to fold, IMO

bet flop and get it in is the only way in my op.

Indy

I make an overbet and push here. You have overs plus a gutshot. Also realize how this is semibluff and it is different situation that the one I posted a while ago:http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/sh...d.php?t=103413.

Saying 'we have 2 overs and a gutshot' is fairly misleading. Sure, if we get run our hand vs 55 then we have 10 outs, but how often is 55 calling our flop shove (or pf 4bet for that matter?). We need to be looking at how many outs we have when our shove is called. Sometimes we'll be up against a set and have ~3 outs, sometimes we'll be up against AJ and have 7 outs, or against QQ and have between 5 and 6 outs.

I'm not saying these are horrible situations to be in because when you add in fold equity + the equity you do still have against his range when he calls you it becomes correct to shove in this spot. I just think some posters/lurkers might get the wrong idea and start thinking we have a monster hand.

I actually don't mind if lurkers get the wrong idea - regular posters will understand that I didn't mean we were shoving for value.

Oh I forgot to answer your question about the flop. Basically it's the same, what is his range here? Vs some players I would c/fold since they have set/AQ/AK minimum and you only fold out AK, if that. Vs some where I feel my FE/more outs on average when called is higher I would just push. So can he have 77+/AT+ and random suited connectors, commit!

this is way too player and match dependent to have a meaningful discussion about, but if i'm betting this flop i'm shoving.

i might check sometimes here if i feel that i have no FE.

if i saw a competent player check this flop i would immediately give him AK, and some small degree JJ, but i would think exactly your hand instantly pretty much everytime. given that, do you think this guy sees that, and if he does would he ever expect you to fold? you say he's been active which obviously makes this an easy 4b, but you don't say whether he's any good or not.

i would probably call this turn due to pot odds and relative strength but if he's any good he puts you AK/maybe JJ here which seems to weigh it towards a fold.