3bet pot 100 NL pokerbros. any thoughts please? is the first time i am posting a hand - Micro Stakes Pot Limit and No Limit

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3bet pot 100 NL pokerbros. any thoughts please? is the first time i am posting a hand

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06-29-2020 , 10:23 AM

GreekDaGrinD

enthusiast

Join Date: Feb 2020 Posts: 83

PokerBros - $1 NL (6 max) - Holdem - 6 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 4

Hero (BB): 115.32 BB
MP: 105.24 BB
CO: 81.34 BB
BB: 200 BB
BTN: 484.6 BB
SB: 158.4 BB

SB posts SB 0.5 BB, Hero posts BB 1 BB, BB posts BB 1 BB

Pre Flop: (pot: 2.5 BB) Hero has K

MP raises to 3 BB, fold, fold, BTN calls 3 BB, fold, Hero raises to 12 BB, MP calls 9 BB, fold

Flop: (28.5 BB, 2 players) 6

Hero bets 18.5 BB, MP calls 18.5 BB

Turn: (65.5 BB, 2 players) K

Hero bets 32.75 BB, MP calls 32.75 BB

River: (131 BB, 2 players) 7

Hero bets 52.07 BB and is all-in, MP calls 41.99 BB and is all-in

Hero shows K

(One Pair, Kings)
(Pre 45%, Flop 17%, Turn 9%)
MP shows 9

(Three of a Kind, Nines)
(Pre 55%, Flop 83%, Turn 91%)
MP wins 210.73 BB

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06-29-2020 , 10:42 AM

kvnd

veteran

Join Date: Jun 2013 Posts: 2,290

Why did you 3 bet so small pre? Post seems fine

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06-29-2020 , 10:51 AM

jeccross

Pooh-Bah

Join Date: May 2005 Posts: 3,807

Quote:

Originally Posted by kvnd

Why did you 3 bet so small pre? Post seems fine

4x is small? I know theres a caller, but this is nitpicking

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06-29-2020 , 12:04 PM

JohnRusty

veteran

Join Date: Apr 2018 Posts: 2,755

Hand is too weak to squeeze pre. Suited it’d be standard

Flop sizing seems too big

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06-29-2020 , 12:05 PM

whitemares

Pooh-Bah

Join Date: Nov 2014 Posts: 5,786

Squeeze pre is a little light but it's not terrible

Your bet sizing is a little wonky, you shouldn't get to the river with <1/3 pot effective

Quote:

Originally Posted by jeccross

4x is small? I know theres a caller, but this is nitpicking

No it's not, should be closer to 5x without the caller

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06-29-2020 , 12:09 PM

JamAdebayo

old hand

Join Date: Apr 2020 Posts: 1,522

Quote:

Originally Posted by whitemares

Your bet sizing is a little wonky, you shouldn't get to the river with <1/3 pot effective

Do we want bigger flop jam turn or slightly smaller flop slightly smaller turn?

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06-29-2020 , 12:33 PM

jeccross

Pooh-Bah

Join Date: May 2005 Posts: 3,807

Quote:

Originally Posted by whitemares

Squeeze pre is a little light but it's not terrible

Your bet sizing is a little wonky, you shouldn't get to the river with <1/3 pot effective

No it's not, should be closer to 5x without the caller

closer to 5x, i.e. less than 1bb difference, hardly a huge deal. People love to point these things out because it avoids discussing hard but - i.e. the rest of the hand.

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06-29-2020 , 01:32 PM

whitemares

Pooh-Bah

Join Date: Nov 2014 Posts: 5,786

5x without a caller, should be closer to 6x here, which is a 6bb difference, pretty substantial

Quote:

Originally Posted by JamAdebayo

Do we want bigger flop jam turn or slightly smaller flop slightly smaller turn?

Not totally sure, but I'm inclined to think we have more incentive to go bigger flop and jam turn when oop

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06-29-2020 , 01:47 PM

jeccross

Pooh-Bah

Join Date: May 2005 Posts: 3,807

Quote:

Originally Posted by whitemares

5x without a caller

Sorry, I meant less than 1x different. 5x oop without a caller is not standard.

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06-29-2020 , 01:58 PM

#10

whitemares

Pooh-Bah

Join Date: Nov 2014 Posts: 5,786

From BB it is, maybe should be closer to 4.5x vs a 3x

edit: but yeah 1bb isn't much of a difference, but 3bb is

Last edited by whitemares; 06-29-2020 at 02:06 PM.

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06-29-2020 , 02:14 PM

#11

kvnd

veteran

Join Date: Jun 2013 Posts: 2,290

Quote:

Originally Posted by whitemares

5x without a caller, should be closer to 6x here, which is a 6bb difference, pretty substantial

Not totally sure, but I'm inclined to think we have more incentive to go bigger flop and jam turn when oop

I thought a half pot, half pot, half pot line would be best

Also agree this is too loose to be a 100% frequency squeezea

Also @preflop sizing and jecross, this 3 bet is 4.5bb smaller than I'd make it, pretty big difference

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06-29-2020 , 02:18 PM

#12

jeccross

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Join Date: May 2005 Posts: 3,807

Quote:

Originally Posted by whitemares

From BB it is, maybe should be closer to 4.5x vs a 3x

edit: but yeah 1bb isn't much of a difference, but 3bb is

Whats the source for this?

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06-29-2020 , 02:39 PM

#13

whitemares

Pooh-Bah

Join Date: Nov 2014 Posts: 5,786

Mid/hs regs

Those games play different than micros, but ip opening ranges are still pretty similar

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06-29-2020 , 03:05 PM

#14

jeccross

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Join Date: May 2005 Posts: 3,807

Quote:

Originally Posted by whitemares

Mid/hs regs

Those games play different than micros, but ip opening ranges are still pretty similar

Can't say I've ever seen anyone say over 4x is standard, but ok.

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06-29-2020 , 03:13 PM

#15

JohnRusty

veteran

Join Date: Apr 2018 Posts: 2,755

Quote:

Originally Posted by jeccross

Can't say I've ever seen anyone say over 4x is standard, but ok.

I also am confused about where all these ideas about 3-bet sizing come from. I really don’t think 5x is standard

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06-29-2020 , 03:16 PM

#16

whitemares

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Join Date: Nov 2014 Posts: 5,786

Maybe I'm wrong to say that it's "standard" at micros because bigger sizings from the BB haven't really caught on yet at this level, but I'm inclined to believe that it's more correct than the <4x that is more common

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06-29-2020 , 03:25 PM

#17

jeccross

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Join Date: May 2005 Posts: 3,807

Quote:

Originally Posted by whitemares

In the grinders manual he recommends 10bb v a 3bb open oop and 8BB ip. 3x ip and 4x oop seem pretty standard to me at the tables. As I said I've never seen anyone call more than 4x oop "standard".

Either way, this is all nitpicking to avoid addressing the actual hand (which I've ended up doing now after complaining about people doing it).

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06-29-2020 , 03:32 PM

#18

GreekDaGrinD

enthusiast

Join Date: Feb 2020 Posts: 83

Guys thank so much everyone!!! now when i see again this hand maybe was best to 3bet a bit bigger you are correct or dont 3bet at all and play postflop..and do you think if i was betting smaller on the flop he will raise my bet?? or if he still call me down till river i can fold when he raise??? will be hard for me to fold this hand :P

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06-29-2020 , 03:34 PM

#19

whitemares

Pooh-Bah

Join Date: Nov 2014 Posts: 5,786

Grinder's manual is still a pretty solid book for micros, but I think it's starting to become a bit outdated. SB sizings are now becoming smaller than BB sizings because of how the ranges are made up

You're right, we are getting off track a bit here, but the original comment that his squeeze is too small was still definitely worth bringing up

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06-30-2020 , 07:43 AM

#20

pokerforumposter

adept

Join Date: Jan 2017 Posts: 857

flop should be smaller or way bigger, turn you absolutely need to check, your hand is not that strong for 3 streets here and if you get raised ott you are absolutely screwed with tp2k and gutshot.

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06-30-2020 , 08:02 AM

#21

2019fish2019

old hand

Join Date: Jul 2019 Posts: 1,412

Quote:

Originally Posted by pokerforumposter

flop should be smaller or way bigger, turn you absolutely need to check, your hand is not that strong for 3 streets here and if you get raised ott you are absolutely screwed with tp2k and gutshot.

+1 big-ish flop sizing narrows his range so much that idk if we can continue betting for value ott

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06-30-2020 , 09:24 AM

#22

Ojune

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Join Date: Feb 2017 Posts: 5,171

Quote:

Originally Posted by whitemares

Mid/hs regs

Those games play different than micros, but ip opening ranges are still pretty similar

don't forget solvers

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06-30-2020 , 12:45 PM

#23

kvnd

veteran

Join Date: Jun 2013 Posts: 2,290

Quote:

Originally Posted by pokerforumposter

turn you absolutely need to check, your hand is not that strong for 3 streets here

nit

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