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3 bet pot

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05-01-2014 , 11:30 AM

Yoshimiii

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Apr 2013 Posts: 7,669

Hand sample: 172

29/23/5.3

9.4% 3 bet
20% fold 3 bet (5)
57% STL BTN

Value from Ax?
Or bluff me off Ax?

31% required to break even

[converted_hand][hand_history]Poker Stars, $0.10/$0.25 No Limit Hold'em Cash, 4 Players
Poker Tools Powered By Holdem Manager - The Ultimate Poker Software Suite. View Hand #26420441

BB: $31.73 (126.9 bb)
CO: $37.30 (149.2 bb)
BTN: $40.71 (162.8 bb)
Hero (SB): $25.70 (102.8 bb)

Preflop: Hero is SB with J

CO folds, BTN raises to $0.50, Hero raises to $1.75, BB folds, BTN calls $1.25

Flop: ($3.75) 7

(2 players)
Hero bets $2.38, BTN raises to $6, Hero calls $3.62

Turn: ($15.75) 7

(2 players)
Hero checks, BTN checks

River: ($15.75) T

(2 players)
Hero checks, BTN bets $13, Hero ???

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05-01-2014 , 12:07 PM

99loki

stranger

Join Date: May 2014 Posts: 3

i think the call in the flop is fine because nothing worse is calling a re raise and fold river because most of the semi bluffs got there

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05-01-2014 , 12:13 PM

koskosmo

journeyman

Join Date: Mar 2014 Posts: 217

His line doesn't make sence to bluff you off Ax.maybe he thinks you can fold Ax on the river cause at best is a split pot.Raising AT and valuebetting river,but you have fd's in your range,check back turn wtf? Pure bluff with missed draws? Not a lot of combos of monster hands.call and make a note I think.

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05-01-2014 , 12:54 PM

daniel9861

veteran

Join Date: Feb 2009 Posts: 3,390

Well your hand looks like what it is. At first I was thinking maybe he's trying to get you off a chop but I don't think he's the type of player to raise Ax on the flop in a 3bet pot. Feels like he rivered something or decided to slowplay for some reason. They always seem to have it in spots like this where the line doesn't make sense against me so it's probably a fold.

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05-01-2014 , 01:06 PM

cruisecontrol204

old hand

Join Date: Nov 2013 Posts: 1,240

agree with dan, vill getting tricky. flopped 2 pair, set or huge draw. i will lean towards a fold on the flop raise here. because, we're oop and will have trouble calling when the board gets wetter. all because the flop raise. not strong enough to called raise oop with 2 streets to come, imo

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05-01-2014 , 01:28 PM

Yoshimiii

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Apr 2013 Posts: 7,669

Quote:

Originally Posted by cruisecontrol204

all because the flop raise. not strong enough to called raise oop with 2 streets to come, imo

Not folding AJ to one raise in a 3bet pot vs a LAG on the flop.

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05-01-2014 , 02:18 PM

lumileijona

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Jul 2009 Posts: 8,020

I make it 8bb OOP when someone minraises. But that's just me.

Flop the only question to me is whether to flat or reraise it. I would flat most of the time but the issue is that it's unlikely he will keep on betting to get you off Ax if you flat. If you reraise you could still have air as his raise looks so FOS and he could shove a draw.

River is crappy as sin. QJ got there and he bets really big. I have no idea. I probably call at the table, but since you would look so unlikely to fold Ax, and he seemed to give up OTT, it might be a fold.

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05-01-2014 , 03:20 PM

TheDefiniteArticle

Indecisive

Join Date: Feb 2012 Posts: 14,125

No idea what villain's range is so call about 55% of your range (so call here).

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05-01-2014 , 08:59 PM

rival4653

centurion

Join Date: Jul 2013 Posts: 155

I can't get past the check Ott. Why would v not bet either for or against the draw. Also the min raise pre doesn't look like Ak or Aq. Qj Def possible. Probably not A10. Once you call the c/r is v really going to bluff river? I don't mind a fold here, but a call isn't horrible. Just a crap spot.
.

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05-01-2014 , 09:06 PM

#10

lumileijona

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Jul 2009 Posts: 8,020

Quote:

Originally Posted by rival4653

Because pre flop 3 bettor bet calling that flop has Ax way more often than not.
And 7 pairing changes nothing and it's unlikely hero is folding an ace on that card.

This is why I don't think villain will bluff the river either very often. And every QJ combo is probably in his range.

The more I think about it the more I lean towards 3 betting the flop to keep our range wider, to charge villain since he almost always has air/draw and to
potentially make him shove. It's just too unlikely he keeps on barreling when we call a raise on that flop. J93tt he would be more likely to barrel turns.

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05-01-2014 , 09:23 PM

#11

rival4653

centurion

Join Date: Jul 2013 Posts: 155

Quote:

Originally Posted by lumileijona

3 betting the flop is probably the best play. The more I think about the hand V most likely has qj exactly.

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05-01-2014 , 11:59 PM

#12

ForeverLearning

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Join Date: Jul 2010 Posts: 12,006

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheDefiniteArticle

No idea what villain's range is so call about 55% of your range (so call here).

We probably don't need to defend 55% unless we're always checking river giving villain a guaranteed opportunity to bluff.

Also assuming we're not 3betting this guy with A9- (we shouldn't because of his low f3bet%) nor bet/calling Kx on the flop and assuming we're betting busted draws on the river, AJ is the bottom of our range so we can fold.

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05-02-2014 , 12:51 AM

#13

VincentNgo64

stranger

Join Date: May 2014 Posts: 14

He folds to 3bet once in 5 times so his calling range pre flop is pretty wide. His AF is 5.3 so I don't think he would flat with AK here. Although he could slowplay AA KK, or flat with 77 and A7, his check back turn was very weak since the 7 was the perfect card to vbet cause you would call a lot with Ax thinking about splitting. So his range could be flushdraw which raised flop to buy a free card on the turn or AJ A2s+. Calling is the best option here imo

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05-02-2014 , 06:36 AM

#14

Qu1ck

adept

Join Date: May 2014 Posts: 850

I`d enter a x\c mode OTF.

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05-02-2014 , 06:45 AM

#15

TheDefiniteArticle

Indecisive

Join Date: Feb 2012 Posts: 14,125

Quote:

Originally Posted by ForeverLearning

It's better to call with than, say, AK though because we block QJ.

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05-02-2014 , 07:35 AM

#16

CCM

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Feb 2009 Posts: 6,528

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheDefiniteArticle

It's better to call with than, say, AK though because we block QJ.

AK beats Ax and AT though. Don't really think blocking 25% of QJ combos outweighs that.

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05-02-2014 , 07:44 AM

#17

Yoshimiii

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Apr 2013 Posts: 7,669

AK is way better lol. AK beats AT. He had AT

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05-02-2014 , 07:58 AM

#18

TheDefiniteArticle

Indecisive

Join Date: Feb 2012 Posts: 14,125

lol, assumed regs weren't bad enough to raise Ax OTF

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05-02-2014 , 08:03 AM

#19

CCM

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Join Date: Feb 2009 Posts: 6,528

Never 100% assume, just discount it.

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05-02-2014 , 08:12 AM

#20

MartimC

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Nov 2011 Posts: 6,637

AT non heart probably not a bad raise otf given positions, would prefer AQ AJ, AT is meh

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