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25NL - playing with QQ 25NL - playing with QQ

09-26-2015 , 12:10 AM
    WPN, $0.10/$0.25 No Limit Hold'em Cash, 5 Players
    Poker Tools Powered By Holdem Manager - The Ultimate Poker Software Suite.

    SB: $17.44 (69.8 bb)
    BB: $29.71 (118.8 bb)
    MP: $30.97 (123.9 bb)
    CO: $27.83 (111.3 bb)
    Hero (BTN): $25.22 (100.9 bb)

    Preflop: Hero is BTN with Q Q
    MP raises to $0.75, CO folds, Hero calls $0.75, 2 folds

    Flop: ($1.85) K 5 9 (2 players)
    MP bets $1.25, Hero calls $1.25

    Turn: ($4.35) 4 (2 players)
    MP bets $2.25, Hero calls $2.25

    River: ($8.85) K (2 players)
    MP bets $5.60, Hero folds

    Spoiler:
    Results: $8.85 pot ($0.44 rake)
    Final Board: K 5 9 4 K
    MP mucked and won $8.41 ($4.16 net)
    Hero mucked Q Q and lost (-$4.25 net)


    Villain : unknown

    I believe that folding on the river is fine.

    Many players does not triple barrel with worse than TP.

    My question is do i need to fold on the turn?
    25NL - playing with QQ Quote
    09-26-2015 , 12:33 AM
    3b pre. Flatting makes absolutely no sense to me.
    As played fold turn. Many players, especially unknown fish don't cbet the turn again with anything less than a K here. Sure there are some, but i think its spew against an unknown.
    25NL - playing with QQ Quote
    09-26-2015 , 02:48 PM
    How come you decided not to 3 bet?
    25NL - playing with QQ Quote
    09-26-2015 , 03:06 PM
    Don't mind flatting IP with QQ/AK sometimes.
    25NL - playing with QQ Quote
    09-26-2015 , 05:57 PM
    Flatting is o.k. as long as they folf much to 3-bets you should have a very small value range and a wide light 3-bet range.
    Flatting QQ,AK is kind of standard then, just to play them postflop.
    Many think its good vs UTG but thend to 3-bet vs MP and later.
    But really depends, if they only 4-bet QQ+,AK and fold the rest flatting is better.

    All is changing with squeezehappy people but also then i think you can 4-bet them, some like more to flat KK+ if squeezers behind.

    Its just you dont want to broke with this hands and with 3-betting you turn them into a bluff then.

    And if you 3-bet/fold this hand you often fold out Equity but you cant +EV broke vs QQ+,AK with QQ or AK.

    Same problem you faced if you get 3-bet with this range and have QQ,AK oop, so with 4-betting maybe some fold AK,QQ then but most people dont and if you think form a balanced standpoint the problem is just ugly.
    You then can 3-bet everything if they fold QQ,AK and the story goes on, thats why for some balancing reasons you have to broke the hands to not get exploited.
    To avoid this problem you just flat theese hands and against a very tight range oop you have problems with theese hands also, so with balancing you can broke them just because even you are in bad shape, on the other side the opponent is 3-betting or 4-betting to less (and you profit from that), but with the high rake you cant play like GTO i think, you have to fold sometimes.

    Last edited by philkill; 09-26-2015 at 06:12 PM.
    25NL - playing with QQ Quote
    09-26-2015 , 06:08 PM
    I'd estimate that 3betting an unknown in this spot is more profitable than flatting. It's not like flatting is really bad or something, just lower EV imo.

    Postflop looks okay, turn is kinda close though, don't really like the sizing.
    25NL - playing with QQ Quote
    09-26-2015 , 06:18 PM
    An unkonwn propably calls to much 3-betting seems better, but what you do if you get 4-betted ?
    Do you just broke for balancing reasons even you think his range is QQ+,AK ?
    25NL - playing with QQ Quote
    09-26-2015 , 06:26 PM
    If I get 4bet I'd just go by my population reads (which I am clueless about regarding NL25) and take whatever decision I think has the highest EV.

    Even if that's the population calling range vs 5bets you just mentioned, jamming is still okay because the population also 4bet bluffs, right?
    25NL - playing with QQ Quote
    09-26-2015 , 09:26 PM
    Def 3bet pre!

    Post is fine as played! If villain had bet more on the turn you could have folded one street earlier.
    25NL - playing with QQ Quote
    09-27-2015 , 04:39 AM
    Wp imo. River brings worst bluffing card so i believe he has Kx or better almost always here.
    25NL - playing with QQ Quote
    09-27-2015 , 09:07 AM
    Agree that 3betting pre is much better than flatting.

    As played, I'm folding to the turn bet.
    25NL - playing with QQ Quote
    09-27-2015 , 09:12 AM
    not folding turn with those odds, river is a comfortable fold since he has relatively few busted draws and its not a board many ppl will triple barrel
    25NL - playing with QQ Quote

          
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