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25NL KQ makes TP on drawy board 25NL KQ makes TP on drawy board

10-25-2008 , 08:15 PM
Villain has not been at the table long so no real reads.

Is my play on the flop ok? On the turn do we prefer to check behind or just shove?

Party Poker $25 No Limit Hold'em - 6 players
The Official 2+2 Hand Converter Powered By DeucesCracked.com

UTG: $25.25
MP: $54.42
Hero (CO): $23.04
BTN: $25.75
SB: $50.11
BB: $23.03

Pre Flop: ($0.35) Hero is CO with Q K
2 folds, Hero raises to $1, 2 folds, BB calls $0.75

Flop: ($2.10) J K 3 (2 players)
BB checks, Hero bets $2, BB raises to $4, Hero raises to $8, BB calls $4

Turn: ($18.10) T (2 players)
BB checks

Hero?
25NL KQ makes TP on drawy board Quote
10-25-2008 , 08:31 PM
Don't min 3 bet flop, something like 10-12 is better, if you choose to 3 bet. Since our hand improved, as played I like shoving the turn, he could be on a draw, we have equity against KJ or 33 now, and he is unlikely to pay us off if an ace or nine comes on the river.

It is definately ok to just be calling the min raise on the flop though, some villains do this with top pair type hands but we don't beat AK or KJ, and on the turn we don't beat KT.
25NL KQ makes TP on drawy board Quote
10-25-2008 , 08:33 PM
With no reads this a tough spot as min-raises at this level can mean different things from different players. Some would take this line with KK/JJ/KJ/33 here hoping to check raise all in on turn when you fire another barrel after they show weakness by checking and others with min-raise their draws hoping that the turn will check through and they get to see river free. I may be called a nit for this, but I think we have to check behind for pot control - There just are not a lot of hands we beat that will call your shove on this board (we now lose to AK/KJ/KT/AQ/KK/JJ/33). Also, with only ~$14 left, we can easily get the rest in on safe rivers if we still figure to be ahead and checking behind turn allows him to bluff his missed draws on the river so we get more value from our hand.
25NL KQ makes TP on drawy board Quote
10-25-2008 , 11:58 PM
shove turn. you already raised him you haveto play strong here cant just slow down if he checks to you.
25NL KQ makes TP on drawy board Quote
10-26-2008 , 02:54 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by academis
shove turn. you already raised him you haveto play strong here cant just slow down if he checks to you.
...wtf? we spew our entire stack b/c we decided to spew 1/3 of it on flop?

u beat absolutely NOTHING on turn. c/f

as for flop...dont 3bet imo.

if u 3bet make it larger.
25NL KQ makes TP on drawy board Quote
10-26-2008 , 03:27 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ksight3
...wtf? we spew our entire stack b/c we decided to spew 1/3 of it on flop?

u beat absolutely NOTHING on turn. c/f

as for flop...dont 3bet imo.

if u 3bet make it larger.

this
25NL KQ makes TP on drawy board Quote
10-26-2008 , 05:36 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ksight3
...wtf? we spew our entire stack b/c we decided to spew 1/3 of it on flop?

u beat absolutely NOTHING on turn. c/f
WRONG!
Villain's line really looks like a FD. I think pushing can be good here.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ksight3

as for flop...dont 3bet imo.

if u 3bet make it larger.
RIGHT

You have a marginal hand on a draw heavy flop, try to control the size of the pot.
Check behind on the flop, it's far better than c-betting when you have to fold to a (real) raise. Then on this turn you can put in a delayed c-bet if he checks or call if he bets. The pot will be smaller and you both don't risk lot of money with only TPGK and you get better implied odds for spiking an A or 9 on the river.
You c-betted and you was lucky enough bc he only min-raised, please don't 3-bet.
25NL KQ makes TP on drawy board Quote
10-26-2008 , 11:32 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Eriol
WRONG!
Villain's line really looks like a FD. I think pushing can be good here.



RIGHT

You have a marginal hand on a draw heavy flop, try to control the size of the pot.
Check behind on the flop, it's far better than c-betting when you have to fold to a (real) raise. Then on this turn you can put in a delayed c-bet if he checks or call if he bets. The pot will be smaller and you both don't risk lot of money with only TPGK and you get better implied odds for spiking an A or 9 on the river.
You c-betted and you was lucky enough bc he only min-raised, please don't 3-bet.
I guess not c-betting this flop cant be that bad. However, shoving the turn is. You interpret the flop min raise as a flush draw, but it could very well be two pair, or a set. Against an unknown it could go either way. On the turn, you are almost never folding sets or two pairs. Maybe AK.
25NL KQ makes TP on drawy board Quote

      
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