25NL AA oop on 3flush board vs reg in 3bet pot, hero??? - Micro Stakes Pot Limit and No Limit

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25NL AA oop on 3flush board vs reg in 3bet pot, hero???

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11-14-2012 , 05:25 PM

Exothermic

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Mar 2010 Posts: 16,810

PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em, €0.25 BB (7 handed) - Poker Hand Converter from http://www.pokerconverter.com

saw flop

Button (€25)
Hero (SB) (€41.25)
BB (€21.85)
UTG (€36.53)
MP1 (€29.03)
MP2 (€25)
CO (€9.92)

Preflop: Hero is SB with A

, A

3 folds, CO bets €0.75, Button raises to €2.33, Hero calls €2.23, 2 folds

Flop: (€5.66) 9

, 8

, 5

(2 players)
Hero checks, Button bets €2.87 HERO??

co= 16/13.. fold vs 3bet 33%(6), 370 hands

btn= 23/19, 9% 3bet, 1.5k hands

bb= 38/21 fish over 130 hands

so yea this is not really a question about pre.... but yea how u guys approach flop??

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11-14-2012 , 07:01 PM

lunatic fringe

adept

Join Date: Apr 2012 Posts: 931

I'm ok with pre, although its a good 4-bet spot so there's a question of balance.

Flop: just raise... You'll have plenty of other hands to protect your calling range.

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11-14-2012 , 09:30 PM

Exothermic

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Mar 2010 Posts: 16,810

^^^ i feel i could 4bet n get 5bet shipped on alot by worse cause our dynamic is loose but at the same time i was thinking with fish more than likely to be in pot + SS potentially shoving 5% or so of hands in that spot in what would look like dead $ i thought it was more +Ev to flat

so you raise get it in with AA here?.. n whats ur sizing??

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11-14-2012 , 11:21 PM

lunatic fringe

adept

Join Date: Apr 2012 Posts: 931

^^^ yeah, never folding... the raise is for value from worse hands now as much as it is for protection. I'd go to something like 8.75 which should set up a nice turn shove. You could size it slightly smaller if you think it will widen his bluff shoving range.

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11-14-2012 , 11:56 PM

7ylerdurd3n

old hand

Join Date: Jun 2010 Posts: 1,244

Quote:

Originally Posted by lunatic fringe

generally this. i dont mind flatting 3bets with AA but only when i have position. in this spot i like to 4bet.

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11-15-2012 , 12:21 AM

sexdotcom

Pooh-Bah

Join Date: Nov 2007 Posts: 3,867

Just 4bet preflop. You also get to see how the btn reacts to being cold 4bet.

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11-15-2012 , 12:31 AM

YouFaiil

Concept of the Week Author

Join Date: Jun 2010 Posts: 13,505

flatting pre is sooooooooooooooooooo bad imo

as played, jam flop imo.

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11-15-2012 , 12:53 AM

Exothermic

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Mar 2010 Posts: 16,810

so you guys dont like flatting pre is more +Ev taking everything about the dynamics of the table into account?

obv 4betting n getting it in vs btn is good but i just thought its more +ev calling in this spot

p.s both my calling + 4betting range is wide in general in this spot vs btn so i dont buy that i only have AA or whatever in this spot

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11-15-2012 , 01:07 AM

bronx.system

old hand

Join Date: Sep 2012 Posts: 1,328

i think flat pre is very bad in this spot

#1 your missing to much value not 4b
#2 your oop and giving givng good price to CO tag who will set mine a ton but likely c/f if miss

if you 4b the fish might still stack QQAK

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11-15-2012 , 01:07 AM

#10

sexdotcom

Pooh-Bah

Join Date: Nov 2007 Posts: 3,867

The btn 3bets 9%, did you have a read that he folds a ton to 4bet?

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11-15-2012 , 01:17 AM

#11

YouFaiil

Concept of the Week Author

Join Date: Jun 2010 Posts: 13,505

Quote:

Originally Posted by Exothermic

it wouldnt be bad to only have like KK/AA/AK in ur range in this spot at 25nl. but i think if u 4b get it in or w/e it creates a way better image if u do it again in the session.

that said having AA in ur range in this spot cant be bad either bcos ppl literally only flat like JJ/QQ in this spot, maybe AK too.

i jst think if 4betting is more +ev nd u dnt need to wrry about including certain hands in ranges at 25nl

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11-15-2012 , 03:55 AM

#12

Exothermic

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Mar 2010 Posts: 16,810

@bronx... co= 40bb stack, he cant set mine

@sexdotcom.... no he 5bet bluffs alot or atleast 5bet calls alot vs me but i thought co could shove alot after me n the fish over calls + even if he doesnt shove i feel like ide be 3way alot with the fish in the pot in a 30bb pot already... so with those two potential scenarios i felt like it was worth the risk of just flatting the 3bet

p.s i guess what my question was when posting this hand then was do you think the fish in the bb over calls enough for this to be potentially a more +Ev play than 4bet/calling vs btn??

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11-15-2012 , 04:11 AM

#13

Hicham009

Pooh-Bah

Join Date: Oct 2011 Posts: 3,641

^ I dont hate pre at all, but I hate it everytime I read you saying btn 5b bluffs a lot. This is such a good spot to 4b bluff, granted the SS makes it a bit more gross but w/e, if btn has a slight clue he knows this is a decent spot to be 4b bluffing and he's very likely to 5b bluff you. So the way I see it is, you have a decent chance of getting 200BB in the pot pre whilst being a massive favorite, or praying on the chance the bb over calls. Should be a pretty easy decision dont you agree?

As played I'd raise flop and ship turn, but Fringe alrdy said that so yeah.

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11-15-2012 , 04:49 AM

#14

YouFaiil

Concept of the Week Author

Join Date: Jun 2010 Posts: 13,505

bb is nowhere near loose enoguh to call here enough % of the time to make this decent. just seems too fps, its completely differnet in a standard opened pot tho.

just 4bet

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11-15-2012 , 06:34 AM

#15

sexdotcom

Pooh-Bah

Join Date: Nov 2007 Posts: 3,867

Still don't like the flat because you in the SB. Even if the bb fish dose come along, it would be a 4-way pot with you in the sb. The most likely senario would be the flop gets checked through and the board gets uglier on the turn.
Now you saying the btn 5bet-bluffs alot, all the more reason to 4bet him now.

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