19/17/7 with 6% 3bet 800 hands.

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Hero (BB): $21.82
BTN: $25.11
SB: $14.71

Pre Flop: ($0.30) Hero is BB with T J
BTN raises to $0.60, 1 fold, Hero raises to $2, BTN calls $1.40

Flop: ($4.10) 8 J 4 (2 players)
Hero checks, BTN bets $2.45, Hero calls $2.45

Turn: ($9.00) J (2 players)
Hero checks, BTN checks

River: ($9.00) 3 (2 players)
Hero checks, BTN bets $5.15, Hero raises to $17.37

Pre is bad.

Does TPGK refer to what villain had? A T kicker is not that good or great IMO.

I would have bet the flop, but as played I think both turn and river are fine.

Fold pre.

I wouldnt 3bet this hand pre, but whatever.

Post I would bet three streets. I think theres enough underpairs that he'll call down with to warrant 3 streets. Espec since when you bet the turn he'll think you're FOS.

Your line seems odd when looking at it from villains eyes. 3Bet pre, check, CRAI.

I think you have successfully confused villain - he has no idea what you have right now. Looks fine with trips.

c/c c/c c/r line as pfr is never ever a bluff. Your range looks extremely nutted and villain would have to be bleeding from the brain to call river with worse.

3handed, dude was raising any 2 napkins, just wanted to put a raise in to say "hey bro dont steal my blinds" lol.
i didnt like to cbet, i mean i only thin better is calling/raising and all worse folding. If i get raised i hate life. Plan was to fire any turn when they check back.

why? im prob the best 20nl reg on the site i play, i can outplay most people postflop most of the time, folding JT is never good here unless you think the table is better then you.

Position is important. Can you play TJo oop from the blinds profitably?

at this level yes.

Lol. Then why do we 3bet pre if we can profitably flat this?

other person @ the table was a fish, and as mentioned villian was rasing any two napkins, I think in hindsight, it would of been better to flat with JT and 3bet something trasy. But I wanted him to calm down so i could iso the fish at the table, just thew a 3bet in here so he would calm down because he prob thought he was rolling the table over and wanted to play HU with fish.

posting some other stats/ reads would be really helpful.
The only hand villain will call your raise on river with is 33, which means he's folding like 99 percent of the time. Most likely checking back pp so his range would seem like bluffs and 33. I would just flat the river.

Why are we not betting this flop?

read post 8.

Fold pre
Bet flop
Bet turn
Bet river

dont think that line is more EV+, at least explain why when you say bet flop bet turn and bet river, instead of just saying it without any back up to why it is right.

Fold pre because your OOP and will rarely make a good enough hand to withstand multiple barrells, not to mention reverse implied odds on making a top pair hand thats dominated.

Bet flop because I assume(as villain) that you are cbetting all your air, as well as your strong hands, so when you check here I immediately put you on weakish SD value hand. Some good players will barrell for fun as soon as you check here. Sometimes you will check a monster like JJ here but thats far too few combos for good aggressive villain to worry about.

Bet turn because now he never believes you have Jx, you get value from everything that called flop. And you can set it up to get stacks in on the river versus a range of 99-AA.

Bet river to get value from 99-AA.


If hes got bigger Jx, revert to pre flop reverse implied odds.

Bill Nye says, "Consider the following..."

I think JTo is very strong against the villains opening range. Like, very strong. Strong enough to play profitably oop and i'm rarely folding it pre vs a button open.

He's probably opening somewhere between 40-45% pfr. I mean, poker stove that ****. It's a lot of ****.

So ya, we're oop but our card advantage is so great that we can make up for the positional disadvantage if we play well oop.

I like 3betting sometimes, and I like flatting sometimes. If the villain likes to call a lot of 3bets ip, i'm more apt to just flat here.

I'm also more likely to flat here if we had JTs but since it's JTo we're gonna have less post flop playability and less implied odds anyway so it's fine to turn your hand into a bluff here and throw out a 3b. Either is fine and very dependent on the situation

Were you 3betting for value or as a bluff?

considering that he's 19/17 i'd say he's much more likely to raise or fold here. Probably calling with stuff like KQ, KJ, ATo, 99, some bigger SC's, the type of stuff he can play but not really 4b for value. And I doubt he knows too much about 4b theory or has too many 4b bluffs in his range.

On the flop, I'm the kind of guy that would cbet here. He's likely to float with some stuff like AQ, AK, maybe KQ, and he has some gutters and PP's that he can call with as well.
TT, 99, T9, 67s, QTs, that kind of stuff. with that said, if he's more likely to bet when we check to him with these hands also, then it's probably close between a check or cbet since he'd also flat your 3b with QJ+ so it's a lot more thin than it looks.

As played:

It really depends on the opponent but he's probably going to check back an 8 on this river and value bet 99+ and better J's.

He may also turn his misses into a bluff some of the time.

I like check/raising the river. Especially if he'll bet an 8 or 77 when you X to him because you get the same amt of value you would if you lead river (as played, he'd probably call a river lead w/ any pair) and the opportunity to get a hero call out of all of those hands when you check/jam.

Well played, I think the flop cbet is a lot thinner than people are giving it credit for and very dependant on your opponent and their style of play.

Remember that there is a very small STP Ratio in 3bet pots and when you're oop with a wk top pair like this, we have to be very wary along with trying to maximise value vs our opp's range. It's a trickier spot than it looks like.

Well played, even tho check/raising the river here is probably the best play, I sometimes can't find the guts to check here because I don't want to lose value from hands that would call a bet, but are going to check bac,

^about to play now, will read that when i finish my session

fold pre even if were better then villain? I think 3way its at least a call, as we can be ahead of there stealing range.

I fully agree with what you say about I would bet flop when missed, I dont think we need to balance @ 20nl tho? if we bet flop, and bet turn I dont know what calls expect for better hands then JT.

I have moved down from 50nl because I had to cash out, I think i just keep leveling my self in spots like this?? and over complicate things?

I dont agree with that. Villain could check back almost every worse hand here that would call a bet.

Yes its villain dependant, do we know how thinly hes going to value bet am river in a 3bet pot?

When the J pairs the turn, 99+ is not folding to a turn bet.

Im a nit from the blinds, I learnt that playing OOP was the worste situation in poker, at 50NL regs will make you pay, at 25NL, not so much.

do you know why people steal light?

Because people suck at playing oop and so they play nitty out of the blinds.

Otherwise, why would the avg reg at any limit be able to play like 45/40 or 50/45 effectively, because everyone's a pussy and afraid to play back,

This guy seems confident that he can play this hand oop, I would play this hand oop. I think it's too strong to fold.

Along with that, I don't let people steal my blinds. So if you're at my table, don't try to steal my blinds unless you want to be put in some sticky ass spots until you get sick of trying to steal my blinds lol.

And yes, good players can value bet. That's how they make money, I would NEVER check back 99 if I were this guy.

Like i said, i might not be able to check this river unless I was very sure that he was gonna value bet, but just by his stats he seems taggy.

Don't forget that TAGs are tight AND Aggressive, valuebetting is how they make money and they feel stupid when they miss value bets. I'd feel stupid here,

point is, the river is close between c/r and betting. It probably shows about the same amt of profit considering that you stack him when you get paid off to make up for the times he checks back.

Either way, it's a solid line that makes sense. And I am a strong proponent of knowing why you're doing what you're doing.

Just because you don't think that YOU could play this hand profitably oop, doesn't mean that someone else can't.

With that said, I think I like flatting pre more than 3betting... but like I said, it's close and either is fine.

Just because you would...

...Oh NVM, Im sure you get it.



Why does every thread turn into a dick fight on here? So frustrating!

Im a pussy because I want to follow good poker fundamentals and build a solid winning game?

If I fold its because I suck and I dont have the ability to play OOP. Its a wonder Im not busto.


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Putting the dick measuring aside. It can never be a mistake to fold OOP. Infact against good aggressive tags its quite a leak to play OOP. If hes good hes going to put you in tons of bad spots when you make marginal SD value and if he value bets well you can end up getting owned if you decide to get to SD. Also there are spots where you end up calling 2 streets and folding to a 3rd. Thats just setting money on fire.

Look at this hand, you made a relative monster here and you are unsure of how to play it.

Playing with ego and saying "Im not going to be a pussy and let this guy steal my 10c" can never be a good spot, both in terms of EV and in terms of poker mindset.

I wasn't afraid to play unsuited connectors out of position, either, until I looked at their long term performance in my PT3 database. Now I fold them.

I admit I have much work to do in this area. Defending from the blinds is my #1 area of study right now. First off is what to defend with, and next comes "how", esp. when you whiff the flop most of the time.